Do I buy a D4 or wait?

cowleystjamescowleystjames Posts: 74Member
edited July 2013 in D3/D4/D5
I'm going to look at a D4 tomorrow as a higher frame rate camera than my D800e.
What's brought this about? Well, I've started taking racehorse pictures for a few trainers around and about Lambourn, Berkshire, and more and more, I'm being asked for series photographs of a few of them galloping. The D800e is okay for a few frames and then I hit the buffer, whether it's jpeg(better) or raw(I mainly shoot raw but have been using jpeg to get a few more images together, not ideal)
I've been looking at the D4, but I'm concerned with the 16mp over the D800e 36mp and this is a concern as I've had to have some images printed at A1 size, and with the D800e they still look absolutely stunning, but at 16mp?
That's the question, I know how great the D4 is, but with increasing rumours of a possible D5 or D4x with almost certainly a higher megapixel sensor, do I wait or bite the bullet?

Comments

  • obajobaobajoba Posts: 206Member
    You can get amazing A1 prints from a D4 at ISO3200, I haven't tried beyond ISO3200 but I know that my 24x36 print at that ISO was stunning and clear (resampled in PS to 300dpi @ 24x36). Compared to prints from a D800e, yeah, you will notice a difference. Will your clients? Not likely IMHO.

    As for waiting? Well, as with all technology, you could be waiting for a very long time. I wouldn't trade my D4 for anything else that's on the market but I primarily shoot sports.
    D4 | 70-200 2.8 VR | 24-70 2.8 | TC-17e II
  • Golf007sdGolf007sd Posts: 2,840Moderator
    edited July 2013
    Get the D4....you will find it perfect for your task. I will post some horse racing shot I took at the opening day @ Del Mar for you to look at when I get home or go to my Flickr account and see for yourself.

    All shot with a D4 /w 70-200 2.8 VR II -- I did not use any teleconverters on these shots.

    ARN_8105.jpg

    1/500 ISO 160 @ f/6.3
    Larger Size of Image

    ARN_8345.jpg

    1/400 ISO 200 @ f/6.3
    Larger Size of Image

    ARN_8342.jpg

    1/400 ISO 200 @ f/6.3
    Larges Size of Image

    ARN_8195.jpg

    1/320 ISO 110 @ f/6.3
    Larger Size of Image

    ARN_8199.jpg

    1/320 ISO 100 @ f/6.3
    Larges Size Of Image
    Post edited by Golf007sd on
    D4 & D7000 | Nikon Holy Trinity Set + 105 2.8 Mico + 200 F2 VR II | 300 2.8G VR II, 10.5 Fish-eye, 24 & 50 1.4G, 35 & 85 1.8G, 18-200 3.5-5.6 VR I SB-400 & 700 | TC 1.4E III, 1.7 & 2.0E III, 1.7 | Sigma 35 & 50 1.4 DG HSM | RRS Ballhead & Tripods Gear | Gitzo Monopod | Lowepro Gear | HDR via Promote Control System |
  • fatrascalfatrascal Posts: 8Member
    You have a paying client (repeat one at that) who needs those sequence shots now, if you don't give it to them they will still have the need and may look elsewhere.

    As Obajoba said D4 will give you sharp sequence shots at creditable high ISO.

    D4 is a sound investment and is not likely to be obsolete until you have made some money off it.

    I need, and have both D 800/4 and am very happy with what I get out of them.
  • michael66michael66 Posts: 231Member
    edited August 2013
    @cowleystjames Excuse a dumb, newbie question here. Could you rent the equipment? Adorama rents the D4 for $345 a week. ( Okay, you're in the UK, but I was curious for myself. ;) ) Are you making more off the shoot than the rental would cost? Nothing like holding a camera in your hand for a while.

    @Golf007sd Post them! I'd love to see them.

    Added... Wow! Spooky that you posted as I asked. Great shots. I love the first one. Did you manage to get any sequences? Yeah, pressing my luck here, I know.
    Post edited by michael66 on
  • PeterPhamWesleyPeterPhamWesley Posts: 19Member
    edited August 2013
    Hi cowleystjames.

    Hope you enjoy the D4. Just like what micael66 said, if possible try to rent one. These are some horse pictures taken not from a D4 but a D300.

    @michael66: Did you manage to get any sequences? Yeah, pressing my luck here, I know.

    Here are some. I've rented the D4 before and anything the D300 can do, the D4 can do far better. Here is a brief sequence of a hunter show (not a race show) taken with a D300 at 8 FPS. Every shot is in focus. The D4 will look even better than these - and these already look pretty decent.

    These two are almost 200 feet away.

    A1

    A20

    With the D300 you can get upwards of 25 shots such as these - all in sequence. Every shot in focus. Nothing turns people head more than squeezing off a huge burst. Also the shutter sound of the D4 just sounds better. The D300 is like an AK 47 "Ack" "Ack" "Ack" whereas the D4 sounds like a Browning 50 calibur "Boop" "Boop" "Boop" that just keeps going and going.

    A47

    The above one is about 100 to 150 feet away. Anything the D300 can do, the D4 will far exceed. Try doing this in low light and the D300 can't do this. The D4 on the otherhand can do such shots even when it's 7 or 8 pm on a summer day. However by about 9:30 PM it's too dark and, unless there's enough stadium light the D4 cannot do fast action shots in sequence.

    So yes, if you are a sports photographer the D4 is really nice.

    HOWEVER! Just a warning! And this is probably just me, but it might apply to others. The D4's button layout is very different from the D800/E, D600, and D300. It took me a long time before I could get comfortable enough to get good shots reliably. As someone who predominately uses a D300, renting a D800 - it felt like it was a very familiar camera in my hands almost immediately. The D4 on the other hand was very different. I felt as if there was a learning curve that I had to get use too before I could get consistently decent photos - and by then I had to return the D4.
    Post edited by PeterPhamWesley on
  • MsmotoMsmoto Posts: 5,396Moderator
    Look at these and some of the sequence shots......Exif available on all

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/fantinesfotos/sets/72157633809491476/
    Msmoto, mod
  • spraynprayspraynpray Posts: 6,085Moderator
    Whoa, nice stuff there Tommie.
    Always learning.
  • michael66michael66 Posts: 231Member
    Ugh!

    After seeing what @PeterPhamWesley and @Msmoto posted, I now want a D4. I need to find a Sugar Momma or sell my soul. JK but, dang, great stuff. I know how fast these beasts move, both the hoofed and the wheeled variety and have tried these kind of shots with film cameras. Not easy to get a simple shot, let alone a sequence. Well done.
  • cowleystjamescowleystjames Posts: 74Member
    You guys are fantastic, thanks for all your replies. As you can see. I went and bought one and whilst there saw the 85mm F1.4G. Had to have that too
    Went to the gallops this morning (very early!) and managed a run of 36 raw images and no buffering!
    Amazing piece of kit.
    ​Was in love with the D800e, but now, she's my second love and the D4 my first and true......
    By the way, I don't seem to be able to embed a photo of my latest girl, do I need to up my membership or am imageI being a total dumbass(probably the latter)
  • obajobaobajoba Posts: 206Member
    Ahhhh, I suppose none of us mentioned that once you use the D4 it is *really* difficult to go back to using anything else. THat's how I ended up with an upgrade from a D7000 to a D4... (just a small jump, right?)
    D4 | 70-200 2.8 VR | 24-70 2.8 | TC-17e II
  • Golf007sdGolf007sd Posts: 2,840Moderator
    @obajoba: You are dead right on the whole D7000 & D4 usage. The D7000 is not seeing much action these days.
    D4 & D7000 | Nikon Holy Trinity Set + 105 2.8 Mico + 200 F2 VR II | 300 2.8G VR II, 10.5 Fish-eye, 24 & 50 1.4G, 35 & 85 1.8G, 18-200 3.5-5.6 VR I SB-400 & 700 | TC 1.4E III, 1.7 & 2.0E III, 1.7 | Sigma 35 & 50 1.4 DG HSM | RRS Ballhead & Tripods Gear | Gitzo Monopod | Lowepro Gear | HDR via Promote Control System |
  • TwoMetreBillTwoMetreBill Posts: 1Member
    edited August 2013
    Not sure if the ad on the NikonRumors home page is for real but supposedly a new D4 can be had for $4800 at Ryther Camera. The ad does not say whether it is a US model.
    Post edited by TwoMetreBill on
  • cowleystjamescowleystjames Posts: 74Member
    I can see the D800e taking a bit of rest time now I'm using the D4. When I need landscape shots though the D800e will be King again!
  • mikepmikep Posts: 280Member
    it might be better to get a battery grip, get a few more fps

    its up to you, of course, but i would not go out and buy a $5000 camera because someone asked me for a series of a horse galloping

    take 100 pictures, photoshop, change where you are standing, get creative, before you pay 5000

    unless they are paying you 6000 of course :)
  • Golf007sdGolf007sd Posts: 2,840Moderator
    @mikep: They call it the "Sport of Kings" for good reason. :P
    D4 & D7000 | Nikon Holy Trinity Set + 105 2.8 Mico + 200 F2 VR II | 300 2.8G VR II, 10.5 Fish-eye, 24 & 50 1.4G, 35 & 85 1.8G, 18-200 3.5-5.6 VR I SB-400 & 700 | TC 1.4E III, 1.7 & 2.0E III, 1.7 | Sigma 35 & 50 1.4 DG HSM | RRS Ballhead & Tripods Gear | Gitzo Monopod | Lowepro Gear | HDR via Promote Control System |
  • cowleystjamescowleystjames Posts: 74Member
    Already run the D800e with a grip, doesn't make any difference to frame rate.
    But the D4, wow, still amazed by it's capability. Went to a gallop yesterday morning with Nicky Henderson, one of the top National Hunt trainers in the UK, to photograph Bob's Worth , Cheltenham Gold cup winner 2013. Winnings £516, 000, estimated worth £15-20,000,000!
    60 frames in one sequence of this amazing horse coming down the gallops. Nicky was incredulous at the quality of the D4 and 70-200f2.8 VRII.
    And mikep, the idea of these photos is that the owners and trainers want a quick fire sequence of photos to see the gait and muscle tone, not just stitch a group of photo's together, doesn't show them what they want.
    And yes, it does pay well!
  • NSXTypeRNSXTypeR Posts: 2,085Member
    Already run the D800e with a grip, doesn't make any difference to frame rate.
    But the D4, wow, still amazed by it's capability. Went to a gallop yesterday morning with Nicky Henderson, one of the top National Hunt trainers in the UK, to photograph Bob's Worth , Cheltenham Gold cup winner 2013. Winnings £516, 000, estimated worth £15-20,000,000!
    60 frames in one sequence of this amazing horse coming down the gallops. Nicky was incredulous at the quality of the D4 and 70-200f2.8 VRII.
    And mikep, the idea of these photos is that the owners and trainers want a quick fire sequence of photos to see the gait and muscle tone, not just stitch a group of photo's together, doesn't show them what they want.
    And yes, it does pay well!
    If you put it into DX crop you'll get 1 extra fps if that makes a difference.
    Nikon D7000/ Nikon D40/ Nikon FM2/ 18-135 AF-S/ 35mm 1.8 AF-S/ 105mm Macro AF-S/ 50mm 1.2 AI-S
  • Rx4PhotoRx4Photo Posts: 1,200Member
    edited August 2013
    ^^ I've been less than impressed with images from the D800 in DX crop mode - especially when the subject's at a distance as I would imagine these horses would be. Don't know if the D800"e" would be better.
    Post edited by Rx4Photo on
    D800 | D7000 | Nikkor 14-24mm f/2.8 | 24-70mm f/2.8 | 70-200mm f/2.8 | 35mm f/1.8G | 85mm f/1.4G | Sigma 35mm f/1.4 Art | Sigma 50mm f/1.4 Art | Sigma 50mm f/1.4 EX DG HSM | Zeiss 100mm Makro-Planar ZF.2 | Flash controllers: Phottix Odin TTL

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