D810 noise at 400 iso - am I imagining this or not?

no1youknow

Need a little help from the community. Thanks in advance.

I recently purchased a D810. Overall, I love it. Recently, I took an autumn afternoon shot of a tree top against a deep blue sky, at iso 400.

In the sky, there seems to be significant noise (viewed in camera at 100% zoom). I'm not tech-savvy enough to know what type of noise, but I would think that at 400 iso, a clear blue daylight sky should be virtually noise free, even at 36 mp. After raw processing (Aperture) it is the same. High iso noise is not the issue - this is low iso where I am surprised it is even there.

I've since taken other types of "test" shots and I'm recognizing the same type of 'noise' - or at least I think so.

I've looked at any article I can find about D810 noise and - to my eyes - no one seems to have an issue at iso's lower than 1000. I can't seem to 'see' the same thing in other folks shots.

So I don't know if this is normal (as in I'm looking too critically at it, or I'm imagining it?), or very odd. Perhaps I have a lemon? Maybe it's just a blue sky thing?

I'm hoping you all can take a look at the original raw image straight from the camera and give me your quick thoughts. View it at 100%.

Basically, I'm looking for either "no, that's normal" or "holy shit send it back".

Dropbox link is
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/86540994/2014_1012_25061_.NEF

No1

Golf007sd

Hmm...I do see what you mean when I'm looking at it at 100% (1:1). I'm leaning towards the lens...do you have any filters on it? Do you have a different lens to try?

Msmoto

@PitchBlack

+1

nek4life

I just looked at both shots from my D800 and D810 and the RAW files look like this, but looking at smaller jpg versions of the same files on Flickr I can't really see it at all. I can only notice it when I'm zoomed in 100% on the RAW files.

PB_PM

Seems normal enough. Even at ISO400 a little dab of noise reduction can do wonders to an image.

no1youknow

To answer some questions:

I was shooting the previous evening at 400, and forgot to put it to 64 at the end of day (which I usually do.)

It was with an older 50mm D lens, but again, I've shot with that lens on other bodies and never noticed anything unusual.

Regarding noise in a 5 year old camera, I shot for years with my 6 year old D300 and never, not once, thought "hmm, that's a fair bit of noise at 400." Maybe 800 I'd start to notice it. And never on a blue sky. That's why I'm wondering if it's a function of the tiny pixels, or something else possibly faulty.

So far, there doesn't seem to be a consensus. So I'm not sure what to think. The camera store where I bought is a good hour away, so I can't just pop in, and anyway, it is in their interest to say there is nothing wrong with it.

I could use in-camera NR, or Nik's Dfine in post, but that's brings me to my original point - I'm surprised I would have to do that with low iso's.

I'm grateful for all the comments, so please keep them coming.

JonMcGuffin

This topic gets brought up pretty frequently in regards to the D810 being a "noisy" camera and I'll try to give you the short version of what is going on.

Because it has such a high MP rate on a FF sensor, what is going on is that when you view the images at 100% on your monitor, you're actually zooming into the image far more than what you would be if you were at 100% on a 12Mp camera. So you're seeing noise in the 36Mp file that you wouldn't see in the 12, or 24Mp file. Does that make sense?

When you normalize the image, you actually get a very similar noise pattern that what you'd see on say a D600/D610, etc.

One thing you might do would be to downsample the 36Mp file to something 1/3rd or 1/2 the size and then view it then.

Paperman

Ii is not uncommon to see traces of noise on blue sky shots at any ISO in any camera WHEN VIEWING 1:1 .

Bokeh_Hunter

The sky will always have "noise" at every ISO.

Msmoto

I have just examined a shot with my D8000E at ISO 400…… I could not detect any "noise" that would be of any concern up to about a 6 foot x 4 foot print. I am wondering if there is some strange adjustment in camera… In any case, maybe a two button reset would be helpful.

Or, as some of us are approaching as old as dirt, we remember the days of film, and grain. So, even with the noise at ISO 6400 in a D800, which I think is getting objectionable compared to the D4, I have no issue with a basic characteristic of digital photography.

Somehow Phase One keeps running through my head….

Another idea might be to look at some of the masters of the film era. Some of the most valued photos in existence have lots of technical issues, but the content is what is considered to be of value.

Good luck

ThomasHorton

Perhaps the best way to improve the noise of a camera system is to disable the 100% zoom function? :P

If you look for noise by pixle-peeping, especially as JonMcGuffin and others has written, on a very high MP system, you will find noise. That does not make it a bad picture nor a bad camera.

Display the picture as you expect the viewer to see it (onscreen or print) and see if you can see any noise. If you can see noise, then you may have a problem. If you don't see noise, you ain't got no problem.

no1youknow

what does a two button reset do, and how is it done? Does it clear out my settings?

Msmoto

On page 193 of the D800 manual a two button reset is described. If you need the manual:
https://support.nikonusa.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/17722

And, yes, it will restore all the factory default settings

Photobug

what does a two button reset do, and how is it done? Does it clear out my settings?

In general no1youknow its best to read the manual on today's complex DSLR's...of course with the camera near buy so you can try different settings. There are lots of tips in the manual and suggestions and the manuals are much better than 20 years ago.

no1youknow

I took it into my local camera shop, and they thought something was definitely off with it. We even switched bodies, same lens, same CF card, and it's just noisier.

Next step is contacting Nikon, I suppose.

Photobug

Go to the NikonUSA website and find the contact Customer Service and send them the issue and they will probably say fill out the form to send it to Nikon Service center for repair. Your under warranty so no cost to you except shipping to them.

Golf007sd

I took it into my local camera shop, and they thought something was definitely off with it. We even switched bodies, same lens, same CF card, and it's just noisier.

Next step is contacting Nikon, I suppose.

Why didn't the shop replace it for you? How long have you had it?

spraynpray

As I understand it, the D800/810 aren't the low light/high ISO kings. That is because the high resolution sensor has very small pixels so less photons hit each pixel. The D4/D4s at 16mp has larger pixels and so more photons hit each one therefore less noise. Don't forget you are seeing the same number of pixels on your PC screen for the D800/810 or the D4/D4s at 1:1 so you aren't comparing eggs with eggs. The 24 mp sensor seems to be a good trade-off between resolution and hi ISO performance. I believe it is the 'fine-ness' of the D800/810 noise due to the high pixel density that fools the eye at normal magnifications, not that the sensor is magical when it comes to noise.

People here say that the usual ETTR method doesn't work with the D800/810 in fact you should ETTL and recover lots more detail from the shadows - I don't know because I haven't got one but I do know there is no magic that stops noise being exaggerated by ETTL when pushing in post.

Your shot may have been pushed a fraction in post with subsequent boosting of noise as above? I don't know because I wasn't there, but the noise looks OK to me considering how large that image would be if you could see it all on the wall instead of pixel peeping a fraction of it on your PC.

Just my 2c!

no1youknow

The store, a large chain in Canada, has a "no returns above $1500" policy. Had I known about this (my fault completely) I would have at least thought about purchasing elsewhere. But I've never had to return a Nikon product before.

Ironheart

You don't have to return it. Nikon will bring it to factory spec under warranty. Your local shop should at least facilitate the repair process, and at best provide you with a loaner.

I'm still not convinced you have an actual problem, did you compare to a different D810?

no1youknow

I did. But briefly. It seemed to me there was a difference. I want to go in again and make the setting identical, and spend some time taking shots in and outside.

In the down sampled square above, from my image, Pitch-black wrote it was "barely visible", but that seems heavily noisy or pixelated, keeping in mind it's a low iso 400. My 6 year old D300 never showed a blue sky like that, even towards iso 1000 and above.

WestEndBoy

The store, a large chain in Canada, has a "no returns above $1500" policy. Had I known about this (my fault completely) I would have at least thought about purchasing elsewhere. But I've never had to return a Nikon product before.

Which chain is this? (I am Canadian)

PB_PM

I did. But briefly. It seemed to me there was a difference. I want to go in again and make the setting identical, and spend some time taking shots in and outside.

In the down sampled square above, from my image, Pitch-black wrote it was "barely visible", but that seems heavily noisy or pixelated, keeping in mind it's a low iso 400. My 6 year old D300 never showed a blue sky like that, even towards iso 1000 and above.

You must have had a very special D300 then, because both of the D300's I've used show noise in the sky at ISO 200.

Nalchadz

Hello,

I know this is an older post but I am going through the same thing right now. Did you ever resolve the issue?

no1youknow

I went down to Nikon Service HQ, and spent time with one of their D810s. Used the same settings, same memory card and several of my lenses. I was there at least an hour if not more. The shots (and noise) were virtually identical. I can only assume it's several build factors, primarily the ultra high sensor resolution.

Still, I'm glad I did it for peace of mind and don't consider it important anymore. If I have a shot with noticeable noise, at any iso, I use the excellent Nik Dfine.

Nalchadz

Thank you for the response. That puts my mind at ease.