Will the d7000 replacement be mirrorless?

brownie314brownie314 Posts: 72Member
edited January 2013 in D90/D7x00
I have the d7000. Love it. I also own the J1 - love it too, but for different reasons. Just wondering if anyone thinks Nikon will drop a bomb and replace the d7000 with a high end mirrorless, I am thinking something like a better A77. Before I get torched - I know the chances of this happening are low, but after using my J1 for a while, I can definitely see that mirrorless does have certain advantages. So what do you think? Dual processors? Phase detect on sensor? 20 fps with full focus and metering? 80 fps with focus locked. Deep buffer. I know I am dreaming a little (or a lot).

Comments

  • singlecoilpickupsinglecoilpickup Posts: 10Member
    Nikon hasn't really been pushing the envelope too drastically lately. I would doubt the D7000 successor changes form too much. I'm sure it'll be more of an incremental update than a revolution. I especially don't think it's going to be Nikon's first mirrorless DX. I'd expect it to be something like 24MP, better ISO performance, EXPEED 3, same body style but with some of the improvements made to the D600, and that's about it.

    That's just my gut though, of course. I think if it was anything more remarkable we'd be hearing more rumors by now.
  • donaldejosedonaldejose Posts: 3,327Member
    No, if Nikon produces a mirrorless camera it will be a new and separate line introduced next year or even later. Nikon will introduce a D7200 and a D400 sometime this year and they both will be great.
  • MsmotoMsmoto Posts: 5,396Moderator
    @ brownie314 & singlecoilpickup
    Welcome to NRF. I think the discussion is going on in various threads on NRF. And, both of you are expressing ideas as suggested by others.

    IMO, we will eventually see a complete line of mirrorless bodies with both full and cropped sensors. The issue to be solved is in the rapid continuous focus available in the pro bodies when one looks at a reflected image via a mirror, which has not been equaled by the mirrorless technology. Once this is solved by the technicians we most likely will see the end of the DSLR. No need for a mirror will be present if this can be done as efficiently via electronics.

    The new high end DX bodies will no doubt be DSLRs as we have not seen the mirrorless technology, to my understanding, which will focus like the DSLR.
    Msmoto, mod
  • brownie314brownie314 Posts: 72Member
    OK. I agree with most of the comments here. I am almost 100% sure that nikon is not ready to discard the mirrorbox for the next round of upper end DX bodies. So there will be a mirror box. But I would love to see Nikon make the live view mode much better. Maybe put some phase detect on sensor and make the AF really good in live view mode. Then we could have the best of both worlds. When in standard mode, use the optical phase detect mechanism. When in live view use the on-sensor phase detect and still get really good AF performance and get some of the great features of mirrorless (like really good AF in video mode).
  • BlinkingeyeBlinkingeye Posts: 21Member
    Interesting point raised by Msmoto. However, IMHO, the true issue is lenses. If Nikon were to follow the thought that mirrorless cameras are lighter and smaller, then lenses need to be redesigned because the distance from the back element to the sensor will be shorter.

    If the distance were to remain the same, then the bodies will need to be nearly as deep as they are now. Not a real advantage, as I see it.

    However, if electronic view finders can become stunningly better (brighter and no lag) and cheaper (with higher production run numbers) then the sales pitch to professionals will need to be made that they are "just as good or better" than the existing mirror/pentaprism. I believe that is a ways off yet.
  • bjrichusbjrichus Posts: 23Member
    edited January 2013
    IMHO, we have not seen any major innovation from Nikon for a while, just evolution and a willingness to invest in producing higher spec bodies than Canon, who seem to be the only thing that Nikon marketing and development are interested in.

    I have to say that the FX users out there should be feeling pretty good right about now - oil and other QA problems to one side.

    As for DX users, I hope we will see a killer of a product from Nikon that will destroy everyone else for a year or so or the market will pass them by.

    I suspect the 2014 crop sensor higher end mirrorless bodies will cost no more than a D7000 body and outperform it too.
    Post edited by bjrichus on
  • TriShooterTriShooter Posts: 219Member
    Blinkingeye and Msmoto pointed out the two killer shortfalls of mirrorless technology; focusing / tracking capability and the electronic viewfinder. The difference in the details I can see looking through a D3 or a D300 is huge to me, but I think the D7000 viewfinder at the low end of acceptable.

    Electronic viewfinders are just okay for framing, but forget seeing the little details that can tell you exactly the right moment to take a shot. It is more of spray and pray if you are shooting at a distance because the tilt of the head, a burst of dust under a tire as it comes around the curve, the moment when the eyes pick up sparkle from the sunlight are almost impossible to see in real time for me.

    I own and enjoy shooting a fair number of mirrorless cameras for playing around, and to keep from wearing my good cameras out, but acknowledge that all these cameras present their own challenges which are serious enough to make them useless to anyone that makes a living with their cameras when focus tracking, and seeing small details is essential.
  • spraynprayspraynpray Posts: 6,200Moderator
    edited January 2013
    "It is more of spray and pray if you are shooting at a "

    You tokin' a me? /:)
    Post edited by spraynpray on
    Always learning.
  • MsmotoMsmoto Posts: 5,396Moderator
    @ Blinkingeye

    The retro focus design of the short lenses is certainly a problem which will not be an issue on a mirrorless body. And, the ability to have a wide angle lens without the need for retro focus may bring on some very interesting wide lenses without a lot of the distortion issues seen in some current examples.

    But, the size of the body, the ergonomics, ability to grasp it firmly, these would suggest to me that ultimately the lens flange/focal plane distance will be shortened, but the camera itself may not be reduced in size by a large amount. I like the size of a D4. Without a grip I do not like the other bodies.

    Eventually the electronic viewfinder will be as efficient as direct view through the pentaprism. And, one will not actually be able to tell the difference in viewing. We are now seeing an image focused on a ground glass, so an image created on a high quality LCD or other will be quite similar. And, this will be a breakthrough as large as the SLR of the 1950's IMO.
    Msmoto, mod
  • jenhan61jenhan61 Posts: 3Member
    Finally some news about a D7000 replacement. According to the news item om the fronptage it will a camera body which is smaller than the D600. It will have 24 megapixels, iso 100-6400. The most interesting part to me is the fact that it will be smaller than the D600. It means that it most likely will be aimed at the top of the entry level segment thus leaving a spot open for a D400. And this is indeed good news.
    The bad news is that since the D7000 replacement will not be with us before around april, it could easily be autumn before we see the arrival of a D400.



  • spraynprayspraynpray Posts: 6,200Moderator
    AHA! Another good reason to buy a D7000 - the body is bigger than its replacement :>
    Always learning.
  • PB_PMPB_PM Posts: 4,098Member
    The D7000 body is already smaller than the D600, so in other words it will basically stay the same...
    If I take a good photo it's not my camera's fault.
  • KnockKnockKnockKnock Posts: 382Member
    It's hard to read in between the lines of a rumor. I'm guessing the D7x00 will have the locked down mode dial, inverted +/- buttons, up top video trigger, modified lv view switch for vid/stills. Kinda hoping they'll also add the button on the left row for picture control... all the stuff the D600 changed over the D7000. Guessing though. Maybe hoping.

    Nomenclature: The D70, D80, D90 progression was pretty incremental too. Was it no the D7000 that was quite a big shift from the past? I suspect the D7100/D7200, or even possibly its replacement will also be pretty incremental.

    I hope for all the hard-core nature/sports shooters out there, that a D400 exists in the pipeline as bythom.com suggests, but seeing the Canon conversation about the 7D and maybe the corporate view that DX is for non-serious shooters might carry sad weight. It's probably money talking there - but a little cajones could pay off big if Canon really is blinking... pardon the mixed metaphors.
    D7100, D60, 35mm f/1.8 DX, 50mm f/1.4, 18-105mm DX, 18-55mm VR II, Sony RX-100 ii
  • NSXTypeRNSXTypeR Posts: 2,117Member
    Interesting point raised by Msmoto. However, IMHO, the true issue is lenses. If Nikon were to follow the thought that mirrorless cameras are lighter and smaller, then lenses need to be redesigned because the distance from the back element to the sensor will be shorter.

    If the distance were to remain the same, then the bodies will need to be nearly as deep as they are now. Not a real advantage, as I see it.

    However, if electronic view finders can become stunningly better (brighter and no lag) and cheaper (with higher production run numbers) then the sales pitch to professionals will need to be made that they are "just as good or better" than the existing mirror/pentaprism. I believe that is a ways off yet.
    I agree- losing the mirror box would mean a new line of lenses- not a practical thing to do.

    If Nikon were to with a EVF, they'd do it with a pellicle mirror like the Sony DSLRs.

    I've used the EVF on the Sony Alpha 57 and I didn't like it. It takes a while for the viewfinder to know you're using the viewfinder and switch between the larger LCD and the viewfinder.

    It also tends to flicker a little bit, which takes some getting to used to.

    That being said, I used the camera in dim indoor lighting situations. If I was outside it may not flicker so much.

    I didn't quite like the experience of a EVF, and the A57 is a relatively new camera- I hope the Alpha 77 doesn't use a similar EVF or else I probably wouldn't like the experience so much either.

    That being said, it was nice to see the effects of exposure changes instantly. But I still prefer an optical viewfinder.

    All the more reason to buy a D7000 just in case Nikon changes to a EVF next generation!
    Nikon D7000/ Nikon D40/ Nikon FM2/ 18-135 AF-S/ 35mm 1.8 AF-S/ 105mm Macro AF-S/ 50mm 1.2 AI-S
  • MsmotoMsmoto Posts: 5,396Moderator
    Just some thoughts on the idea of an electronic viewfinder. When the SLR was coming out, compared to the rangefinder bodies, mine being a Canon 7 with Leitz f/2 Summacron, I remember the idea of having to look at a projected image as opposed to the "real" view through the eye-level viewfinder. The only advantage was it was right side up as compared to looking into a view camera. Just for those who are unaware of the early view cameras, we learned how to see the photo upside down and it was as natural as anything.

    The day will arrive when all the current complaints about electronic view finders will be a thing of the past. They may even be able to lighten the image so one can almost "see in the dark". Possibly use infrared in special cases. The possibilities are unlimited and in the next 10 years photography will change like nothing ever before. The "when" is the question all the manufacturers want to know. If advances are too rapid, sometimes things are not successful.

    We must have an evolutionary change and not a complete jump from one system to another. And, this is one of the reasons I am guessing the initial pro level mirror-less will have a much shorter flange to film plane distance, a wider mouth, but will have a full functioning adapter to accept all the current Nikkor lenses. The eventual change to a complete line of non-retro focus lenses will be slowly introduced.

    I doubt all this will be here very soon, but the first Nikon will be a crop sensor accepting the current lenses....guessing.
    Msmoto, mod
  • SquamishPhotoSquamishPhoto Posts: 608Member
    By the time an EVF is up to the task I think that mirror-less units will be as low profile as mounting a slim cel phone on the back of a lens on a tripod, with the whole thing being controlled remotely with a digital display.
    Mike
    D3 • D750 • 14-24mm f2.8 • 35mm f1.4A • PC-E 45mm f2.8 • 50mm f1.8G • AF-D 85mm f1.4 • ZF.2 100mm f2 • 200mm f2 VR2
  • DaveyJDaveyJ Posts: 958Member
    The D7000 replacement will be a traditional mirror DSLR. I and many others will probably just go buy one. There are so many pent up demand DX DSLR Nikon buyers who have been waiting and due to Expeed 3 processing and possible improvements to a few D7000 use issues it will sell very, very well. Nikon needs this camera very badly to regain some customer confidence and needs a bottom line home run to help it's sagging profitability. Personally if I could justify buying a D4 for field use I would.
  • MsmotoMsmoto Posts: 5,396Moderator
    I suspect once the technology hits, we will see all varieties. Even a D4 sized body, no pentaprism, but with the landscape/portrait bulk, primarily so one can hold it comfortably.

    And, the idea Nikon needs to hit a home run..absolutely. Maybe the D7000 replacement will be just that. But, for sure, it will not be mirrorless.
    Msmoto, mod
  • sevencrossingsevencrossing Posts: 2,800Member
    the blog is suggesting the latest announcement might be a new high-end Coolpix camera .
    Coolpix cameras could be described as mirrorless, so yes, in a very around about way it, might be
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