Upgrade for d90 in March 2015

Schnitzel

Hey guys I am after some advice on upgrading my camera and having saved up since the D90 came out I am now well placed to make that move. Better dynamic range and image quality is the main driver for the upgrade, I don't intend to upgrade for a long time after this so the balance of 'used kit vs the most current' is hard for me to decide.
I currently own a Nikon D90 and have the following lenses:

DX
10-20 f4.5-5.6
35m f1.8
17-70 f2.8-4.5

FX
50mm f1.8d
70-200 f2.8

For me this is a very active hobby and I mainly shoot wildlife, general street photography/travel and increasingly nighttime /low light photography. Wildlife is my emerging favourite along with night shots (light painting/star trails)

So the options within my budget:
1. Go FX:
a) buy the Nikon d750 as the step into full frame knowing I need to buy a wide angle fx lens. I think my telephoto and 50mm gives me the other range needed.
b) buy a used d800. (I think this might be over kill given its pixels!) but might work out cheaper than a d750).
c) buy a used d700 as a dip into the FX world but this is outdated so not sure it will achieve what I need.

2. Stay DX.
a) wait for the d7200 (effectively same spec as the d750 but dx)
b) buy a used d7100.

The issue for me is I am travelling for the month of April to indo China. Therefore this is a driver in my wanting to upgrade now.

Any thoughts, experience or considerations would be greatly appreciated. I am leaning towards the d750 as the d7200 isn't out until the end of the month, when I will need to have a new camera, and having had time to have played with it.

Msmoto

My opinion and only that, still having a D90 myself..... a D7100, used or new, but avoid full frame. If you make lots of very large prints, over 16 x 20 inches, maybe go FX. But be prepared to spend some money. The body is only the beginning.

Oh, and welcome to Nikon Rumors Forum

Sports

Agree with Msmoto.
Too risky to wait for the D7200, and since the D7100 is not far behind, get one of those. Why not get a new one? Best deal of them all.
(If you see the D7200 as sitting somewhere between D7100 and D750, everything indicates it's much closer to the D7100.)
Your night photo needs, as you list them, don't exactly beg for an FX body, IMHO.

sevencrossing

... I don't intend to upgrade for a long time...
........I currently own a Nikon D90 ....

I used to have a D90 and now have a D800
I still have a D700 but as you say it is outdated and no match for the current generation of cameras
I have no experience of the other cameras you have listed
I have had my D800 since the day it was available and it the best camera I have ever owned
I don't make many poster sized prints but when I do, there is absolutely no worry about IQ
nor do I have worry if I have want to heavily cropp or shoot in poor lighting conditions
I feel no need to upgrade to a D810

If you have an up to date computer ( i5 or i7 8 +GB RAM 1TB + hard drive) don't worry about too many meg whatnots

The difference in IQ between your D90 and a D800 will blow your socks off ( but this will also be true of the D7200)

Things to be aware of.

The D800 is bigger and heavier than your D90, as will an ultra wide angle to replace your 10 -20

You will find the Buttons and dials, very different more complicated than your D90


If you don't intend to upgrade for a long time I would go with the S/H D800 or D7200

Yes the 7100 is something of a bargain at the moment but will you be happy with it, when you realise the D7200 is a better camera ? With expeed 4 it will be better

which ever way you go, you will not be disappointed

heartyfisher

Upgrading from the D90, the best value for you would seem to be the D7200.
1) All your lenses will still work the same.
2) you will get awesome colours, DR and High ISO compared to your D90.
3) it has a 1.3 crop mode that will help with your wildlife shot with your existing tele lense.
4) Awesome AF at least equal best in the Nikon line !

Going to the D800/D700 will mean that you will need to get used to a different camera layout. The D7200 is much closer to the D90 and you will not need to work out how to do things as much..

However, since the D7200 is not out yet.. I would suggest you get the D750. Dont worry about getting a new wideangle FX yet.. all your DX lenses will work with it. In fact it will have heaps better images IQ in DX mode than your D90. You will also have new views to play with using your DX lenses in FX mode or 1.2crop mode. Lots of fun to be had !!
Other points
* The D750 is pretty settled in.. all issues resolved.. The D7200 may have some issues crop up as its a new camera that no one has really used yet.
* The D750 may have the best High ISO capability at the moment.
* handling is similar to the D90, not like the D800.

Taken with my wide angle DX lens on my D610.

WestEndFoto

The key comment you made to me was that you don't want to upgrade often.

In ten years, you won't be able to buy a DX f-mount. DX's only reason for existence was and is to keep the f-mount alive because FX was just to expensive. Sure, there are a few other benefits, but they are minor and most of them are marketing choices and not really related to the inherent differences between FX and DX (weight is an example. the cheapest cameras will always be the lightest and most plasticky).

Your glass will last forever and FX is the best glass and Nikon will continue to produce it.

Regarding MSMOTO's advice, unless you are a novice and are happy remaining a novice (nothing wrong with that if you are), then I don't agree with the print size argument for several reasons.

1.
I will use myself as an example. I cannot be bothered to print. Since I am only looking digitally, superficially, Msmoto's argument is even more relevant. But I am always drilling down into my images, looking at the details. I am always checking out the eyes in a portrait. I want more megapixels and sharper lenses. I think that there is an order of magnitude more people doing that than printing. If you were printing, you would need a mansion to post your top one thousand images. Digitally, I just need an IPad. I think the argument about print size fails to appreciate how fundamentally the market has changed. People that are dismissive of pixel peepers are another group that does not get this.

Note: Someday I will print, but only because my camera club is begging me to. And then, I will likely not take it very seriously - though who knows, I might surprise myself.

2.
With more megapixels, and lenses that step up to that, you can aggressively crop. Check out the picture of a little birdie that Msmoto posted that was taken with a D800 and DC 135 2.0.

3.
You can do this:



and to do this you need the dynamic range of an FX sensor. In my view, dynamic range is more important than megapixels. The bottom half of this image was a black splotch in raw. I could not even tell that there were flowers there, let alone appreciate them.

So my recommendation is buy the D750. As far as lenses go. You are shooting street and low light. I would consider a moderately wide f/1.4, such as the Sigma 35 Art (Sigma is not my cup of tea, but I have to acknowledge that it is a great lens). You may also want to consider the 24mm 1.4G.

My god! Upgrading from a D90 to a D750. I envy you! It will be like you are experiencing photography for the first time.

Perhaps I exaggerate......a bit.......

heartyfisher

In ten years, you won't be able to buy a DX f-mount. DX's only reason for existence was and is to keep the f-mount alive because FX was just to expensive.

LOL ! spoken like a FX elitist !
"Writing your guesses more assertively than everybody else doesn't make you actually know anything more than they do" from a different thread I think it may have been said by @spraynpray

Re no more DX lenses, of course that’s only his opinion and quite unfounded ..

I have a D7000 and a D610.. I am seriously considering upgrading my D7000 to the D7200 and use that as my primary camera as I find the DX cameras suits me better than the FX.

But I did recommend that you go D750 didnt I ;-) well maybe I didnt...

WestEndFoto

Sure it is my opinion. I like DX. I love my Coolpix A. I would love to see a mirrorless interchangeable systems from Nikon with a DXish size sensor. I would have each of a 20, 28, 50 and 85mm "35mm equivalent prime" in that system. But in my opinion, this is where Nikon is headed.

Photobug

@Schnitzel - your in a great position to upgrade and either way, DX or FX be prepared for a huge improvement in your images. You won't believe the difference in IQ and DR.

Background: Got my wife the D90 + 18-105 two months after it came out. She really liked this camera. At the time I was shooting a D300 then moved on to the D7100 and after 14 months added the D750. I shot 9600 images on the D7100 in the first year I owned it and 3,300 images in the first three months with the D750.

Just bought the wife the D5500 + 17-140 lens a few weeks ago. She likes it. I have shot about 100 images with it and it's a really great camera.

Recommendations: Not sure what your budget is but suggest these options. Only you can determine what is best for you, so focus on what your shoot and what is best for you.
1. Sell the D90 on eBay or Craig's List. We were very pleased with the $$$ from the D90 & 18-105mm lens. All depends upon condition and # shutter activations.
2. Buy the D7200 and enjoy the DR and IQ. Continue to enjoy the 1.5x factor DX format provides you on that 70-200mm lens (105-300mm equivalent).
3. If the D7200 is too expensive for your budget than buy a new D7100 ONLY if you can accept that there is a newer body with "perhaps" better specs. If you can't accept that...then buy the D7200...go ahead and preorder it - don't wait.
4. If your budget is tight, then look for D7100 factory refurbished models. Nikon USA constantly runs 10% discounts. Other dealers sell them on eBay as factory refurbished. You get a full warranty so don't let that stop you from buying a refurbished one. Of course, a used D7100 is an alternative just watch condition & # shutter activations.
5. Finally if you really shoot a lot of images in low light and want excellent IQ and DR...buy the D750. You need to shoot 500 to 1,000 images before that China trip to ensure you have mastered the 80% of the features of the D750. Agree with several people to use your wide angle lens in DX mode. Just realize, if you buy the D750 you need a plan over the next 3 years to buy several wide angle zoom lens. To start with stay with your DX wide angle but DO PLAN ON UPGRADES. If this is too expensive, then go back to step #2 - D7200.
6. Be sure you have an external HD to back up those images and lots of "fast" and "BIG" memory cards.

When you come back from China, we all would love to see your images on PAD. I hope the above is helpful. Either way, you are in for a real treat with IQ and DR.

NSXTypeR

I don't think you could go wrong with either the D7200 or the D750 like many members have said. If you could wait, I would say go for the D7200, but since you can't, just get the D750 with the kit lens, since you pretty much have every other focal length covered except for wide (or 28-300 if you want something more inclusive).

Unless you really like wide angle photography, then go with the D7100 and then you won't have to worry about your lenses at all.

I'd like to say that DX is the way to go, but the vibes I'm getting from Nikon are negative about DX. I stick with DX because of budget reasons.

Man, shopping for gear is so much fun when you don't have to worry about a budget too much.

Schnitzel

Thanks so far everyone, lots of genuinely useful views and lots of interesting and relevant points to consider. To answer to a few specific points:

SPORTS: I agree about the risk with the D7200 and waiting for that. After the recent teething problems with the latest nikon releases, I would rather wait to see how that turns out. That kind of leaves me with the D7100 or D800/D750 if I am to have a play prior to my trip and it looks a reasonable price..

SEVENCROSSING: Some really good points about the post processing stage. I have a decent spec computer that could deal with that. (it was an initial concern looking at d800 reviews). I don't produce massive prints, I am like WESTENDFOTO, I do display my pics on digital photo frames/Ipad to show family/friends however, printing the occasional but only upto about A4.

HEARTY FISHER: Love the color in the water picture! Good points about the D750.. I had completely dismissed the crop mode and at double my current mp count for the D90 I am glad to not lose any IQ using my DX lenses.

WESTENDFOTO: Really impressed with the DR from the pic. I have been looking at the 24/28mm for wide angle if I go FX...

PHOTOBUG: Thats good going on the shutter count for first 3 months and some good points. My D90 has been through the wars, it is still working fine but I doubt I would get much for it. I would probably keep it for sentiment like my D50. So, knowing the D7200 is about to be released I am not sure I would be happy buying the D7100, especially with the new Exped 4 on the 7200? I am not opposed to buying second hand if the balance of features outweigh the latest tech (I considered the D800 because it is such a high spec camera)

At this stage I have discounted the D700 when there is the D800 and D750 out there as FX options. I am also leaning away from the D7200 in case of teething problems..

As my trip is so soon and I need to use the camera before going I think I only really have 3 options.
D7100 or
D800 used (probably overkill on the pixel count for me...but tempting if I have the right Glass)
D750 new

If I brought the D7100 when the D7200 is just around the corner I don't want to look back and think 'what if'.. but then if i go D800/750 then I need the glass to support FX.. I wouldn't plan to take my 70-200 due to weight leaving my 50mm and then maybe my wide 10-20 DX unless I buy a new FX lens to cover a wide zoom. Also my 17-70 isn't particularly sharp and I don't want to needlessly buy a telephoto/super zoom as I would rather invest in quality glass so that is another dilemma really.

As I am travelling for a month I really want to have the best tool to assist me in taking good photos. Budget wise I can afford the D750 and some spare batteries for my trip and a new lens if it is <$600/£400. (I can push this up but the girlfriend might start asking a few questions..she is supportive though; she says she would rather photography my mistress than another woman!)

I think i would like to go for the D750 with the right glass to support my trip but I think the D7100 is the competitor. I would also love to post some pics when I am back for critic/opinions.

Schnitzel

I don't think you could go wrong with either the D7200 or the D750 like many members have said. If you could wait, I would say go for the D7200, but since you can't, just get the D750 with the kit lens, since you pretty much have every other focal length covered except for wide (or 28-300 if you want something more inclusive).

Unless you really like wide angle photography, then go with the D7100 and then you won't have to worry about your lenses at all.

I'd like to say that DX is the way to go, but the vibes I'm getting from Nikon are negative about DX. I stick with DX because of budget reasons.

Man, shopping for gear is so much fun when you don't have to worry about a budget too much.

I just posted and then saw your reply , interesting/nice to see I'm on the same wavelength as someone else for my choices... I have looked at the 28-300 kit lens option which might be a good travel option but not the fastest lens..

Shopping is a nightmare! I have saved up since getting the D90 in about 2010/2011 so knowing its taken me this long and adding lenses on the way I want to be certain on what I get! Give it a year however and there will be the next Nikon D"" or D"""" to lust over

WestEndFoto

As I am travelling for a month I really want to have the best tool to assist me in taking good photos. Budget wise I can afford the D750 and some spare batteries for my trip and a new lens if it is

Funny. My wife calls my D800 my mistress. I just tell her that my favorite thing to do with my mistress is shoot her (my wife).

NSXTypeR

I just posted and then saw your reply , interesting/nice to see I'm on the same wavelength as someone else for my choices... I have looked at the 28-300 kit lens option which might be a good travel option but not the fastest lens..

Shopping is a nightmare! I have saved up since getting the D90 in about 2010/2011 so knowing its taken me this long and adding lenses on the way I want to be certain on what I get! Give it a year however and there will be the next Nikon D"" or D"""" to lust over

Haha, I went through that when I got my D7000 when my D40 died. I got the D7000 just because it was getting somewhat cheaper at that time.

I think you'll be well served by any camera you choose in the future. Remember to share your photos with us in the Picture a Day thread!

Photobug

@Schnitzel - its nice to see a OP come back and leave replies to everyone that left a recommendation. Not everyone is so conscientious as you. Nice job. Looking forward to seeing your post on PAD.

heartyfisher

@Schnitzel - its nice to see a OP come back and leave replies to everyone that left a recommendation. Not everyone is so conscientious as you. Nice job. Looking forward to seeing your post on PAD.

Yup what he said :-)

Yeah that pink lake in Melbourne is pretty weird.. smells like rotten eggs... Its not pink most times .. only when its been hot( 40+ degrees C! ) and dry in summer.

KnockKnock

Given the FX lenses you have, I think I'd recommend the D750. Sell your DX gear. Add the 18-35mm f/3.5-4.5G (an under-rated wide lens) and splurge on a good bag so you can take the 70-200 with you. You will be blown away by the capabilities of that trio.

I don't think you could lose with the D7200 and the 18-140, if you can wait for it. But having two great FX lenses tells me you're 66% covered for the leap.

Schnitzel

Having had a sleep on it it comes down to the d750 or d7100.

Thoughts on d750:
The d750 has about 1 stop better ISO and about the same for dynamic range if I have compared correctly. It is also £1100 more than the d7100 option.. Is that good value for money??? That money could go towards news lenses.. Particularly replacing my 17-70..
I'm not bothered about video or a flippy screen.
It would set me on the road to fx in the future.
I have heard issues of AF problems?

Thoughts on d7100:
I know I said I would regret not waiting for the d7200-but is it really that much of a leap over the d7100? I think I would still appreciate the new tech of the d7100 having had a d90. Would people agree?

Used prices for a d7100 in the UK are generally about £550-£600 for less than 10,000 shutter actuations! the body brought new is still about £750 so I save a bit going second hand. Would anyone avoid going second hand? It would give me £150 saving. (I can't find refurbished as suggested)

I think at £600 I would feel like I got a complete steal if the d7100 is as good as everyone says. I would still be able to use all lenses and just swap out the 17-70 for something sharper. But would I regret not going FX...

Schnitzel

Given the FX lenses you have, I think I'd recommend the D750. Sell your DX gear. Add the 18-35mm f/3.5-4.5G (an under-rated wide lens) and splurge on a good bag so you can take the 70-200 with you. You will be blown away by the capabilities of that trio.

I don't think you could lose with the D7200 and the 18-140, if you can wait for it. But having two great FX lenses tells me you're 66% covered for the leap.

Hey, I do like the 18-35 idea, it would certainly keep me covered across the range. I had looked at the 18-35 so I'm glad to hear from someone who rates it. I think that combined with the 50mm and the telephoto would have me covered for what I do.. Saving on having to outlay massively if I went fx

spraynpray

I have the D750 and D7100. Looks to me like the D7100 will suit you fine and leave you money for a lens upgrade. The D7100 is so far beyond the IQ of your ol' D90 (I had one of those too) that you will love it. Especially hi ISO.

Don't underestimate the time it takes to learn a new camera body though so whatever you are going to to do, do it now and RTFM.

sevencrossing

Having had a sleep on it it comes down to the d750 or d7100.

Thoughts on d750...........
:.............Is that good value for money??? That money could go towards news lenses..
.......It would set me on the road to fx in the future........

Questions

Are likely to want do any professional work in the future? eg weddings or sell large prints
If so I would down the Fx route

Can you afford FX ? only you know the answer

To take full advantage of FX

You will need a convenience of zooms 16-35 f4 vr and the 24 -120 f 4 vr or the 24 -70 f 2.8

or a rage of primes

20mm f1.8 and 35mm f1.8

Is NAS more important than your Girlfriend ?

Msmoto

After all the discussion, I think I am still suggesting the D7100. Plus some glass, what ever you want. Over the next year or so, begin to accumulate more high end FX glass.

We have found that the issue we call Nikon Acquisition Syndrome can be very costly, especially if we jump from crop sensor to full frame. Maybe a question could be limited to something like, purely for travel and space is limited.

For example, if you are satisfied with the performance of a particular lens, sharpness, freedom from other stuff, etc., then keep it. A D7100, the 17-70mm and 70-200mm would cover almost all the shots if you are able to squeeze the best out of them.

Good luck.

heartyfisher

@seven lol!

@Schnitzel : consider the D5500 instead of the D7100 .. its quite a camera ! only issue is its AFS only lenses. otherwise the sensor is probably the same as the D7200.

sevencrossing

... I am still suggesting the D7100. ... Over the next year or so, begin to accumulate more high end FX glass.

This is common advice on nrf and something I totally fail to understand

If you are going to buy FX Glass in the future, get an FX Camera in the first place

Schnitzel

@ SEVENCROSSING, I don't intend to do any professional work or sell large prints at this time. I can afford to make the leap to FX body, but I think that my girlfriend is definately more important! I love the 'NAS' abbreviation.

When buying new lenses over the past few purchases I started to get FX for the potential move to lessen the financial strain - this ties in with 'if your buying FX - go FX'.

@ MSMOTO, you have truth in the matter looking at cost vs improvement and investing in glass; I harp on to my brother about lenses holding value!

Thanks to everyones input;

Value wise I should get a D7100, I will still enjoy a gain in improvement over the D90, then I can continue to invest in FX lenses with the difference/saving in price. Then, given that the D7100 is so cheap in comparison, I can look to FX in a few years should I find the D7100 lacking in some way and I will have the glass to support it.

However, I just dont want to regret not going FX as I think this is would be the time to do it..

I think I should get the D7100 but just dont want to be disappointed..

sevencrossing

I think I should get the D7100 but just dont want to be disappointed..

After upgrading from a D90 to a D7100 you are not going to be disappointed

You do however seem to be slightly contradicting your self

You started off by saying
I don't intend to upgrade for a long time after this

you are now saying
I can look to FX in a few years

I think you should do some soul searching. Why you are taking photographs and what you want to do with them