Noise on D7100

Samko

Hey everybody.
I just wonder if it is a normal noise behavior that I have on my D7100. I expect to get randomly noise here, there and all over the photo, but when I push my shadows the noise start to get visible in vertical line structure.

Does anybody have experience on this? Is it maybe the sensor? Or its maybe just normal?

Iso 100 Tamron 17-50mm 2.8-F7.1 shutter 1/2500
Edited in LR5
exposure +1.43
Shadows +76
Blacks -19

Thank You !

https://www.flickr.com/photos/samkogz/25939721830/in/dateposted-public/

spraynpray

Samko, Your problem is that the room is so under exposed in order to get detail in the sky, that it is nearly silhouette. Brightening it to that degree will create noise in any digital file as it is such an extreme dynamic. Read your manual about shooting a bracketed set at two stop intervals and create an HDR in Photoshop or whatever editing software you use. Or you could cut out the sky from the under exposed shot and place it in the correct exposure

heartyfisher

Yes the D7100 is "known" for "banding" when you force/push the shadows or very high ISO. I think there was a discussion a while ago regarding the use of raw processors that showed it more. How did you process your image?

I say "known" bec from what I have read I am not clear/sure if its the camera or the inadequate raw processor that is showing the banding.

spraynpray

@heartyfisher: Would be interesting to know if that is sorted on the D7200. Have you tried trying to drag detail out of near blacks on your D7200?

heartyfisher

spraynpray said:

@heartyfisher: Would be interesting to know if that is sorted on the D7200. Have you tried trying to drag detail out of near blacks on your D7200?

I cant help there.. as I use the raw processor (RawTherapee)that doesn't produce banding anyway.. that is why I say that "Known" for "banding" in quotes as its been shown, but less known, that a "good" raw processor eliminates the banding. IE the "banding" Issue could well be an issue with adobe software which "everyone" uses.

http://betterfamilyphotos.blogspot.com.au/2013/04/nikon-d5200-and-d7100-band-aid.html

PS I use quite a number of Raw processing software.. however the 2 main ones are Raw Therapee and Darktable. ( Darktable is only available Unix ie Linux/Solaris/Mac)

PPS: I just pushed a D7200 JPG and besides the normal noise I don't see any banding.

Samko

Ahhh I dont like it !!! The eyes jump on at as soon as you see it. Dont know why I didnt ask you before.
Its 2016 with 50mp, 4k , 3D ........ and they still make mistake like this. My D90 didnt have it "bending" so its pain now .

But thank you, now I know what it is.

KnockKnock

I can confirm, the D7100 has banding at ISO6400 for me. 3200 isn't noticeable. From what I've seen on DPR, the D7200 doesn't show the banding and the noise is just a little bit better flattened. No gear is perfect. Knowing the gear is half the battle. I suspect there are some post-processing tricks that will help diminish it, but even with a D7200 you're going to be pulling up gobs of noise.

So now you know that if you have to lift shadows that deeply, you'll have to resort to HDR or maybe a D5... or just keep the sun out of the frame ;-)

Samko

Knocknoc . Its not so much that D7100 have it, its more that the D90 and D7000 dont have it, and D7100 have it. Dont make any sense to me.
D5 ? Haha thinking more about D700

KnockKnock

Hah. Yeah, true. But I'd take a D7100 at ISO3200 over either the D90 or D7000 any day.

Samko

What about Iso 3200 D7100 vs D7100 ( with banding effect in mind ) ?

spraynpray

I have a D7100 and Adobe LR and PS and have never, ever, had banding. It is the technique of underexposing and trying to rescue a technically bad shot that is the problem - like I said in my first post above. Even if you don't get banding you get huge noise and no subtlety in the light tones.

heartyfisher

Like what @Spraynpray says, aim to avoid technical mistakes. Note I did not know if my D7200 had banding because I have never had an Image that would need that level of recovery to show it.

Also @samko you have not said how you are processing your images. Are you seeing banding from JPG or are you using Raw+lightroom/etc ?

Samko

Spraynpray. I underexposed on purpose trying out the DR just for fun, exposing for the sun and pushing shadows PP. As for the HDR part, im not a big fan ( photomatix ) of HDR, my photos turn out unreal, like a painting. I have not jet figured out how to edit HDR photos and get a "real" look.

Heartyfisher , I use raw 14bit. PP in lightroom.

spraynpray

@Samko: You need to make the jump to Photoshop. Take a bracket set of three images at +/- 2 stops then use the best areas to make one. Really convincing. I too do not like Photomatix Pro, although plenty do including Trey Ratcliffe.

Samko

Yes ita my standard to make -2 0 +2 , then I edit HDR i matix, and i edit one of the frames in LR ( pulling and pushing shadows/highlight). When I then compare the final image I like the LR version more overall.

Need to learn to edit HDR, I dont use it that much, but sometimes im "forced" to do it.

I just wounder how the D700 behaves in DR.

heartyfisher

@Samko
"Its 2016 with 50mp, 4k , 3D ........ and they still make mistake like this."
"I use raw 14bit. PP in lightroom."

Looks like you may not have read the linked article thoroughly enough or misunderstood my previous posts. So I will state it clearly.

The Banding may be caused by the third party, adobe group of software like Lightroom. It may not be the fault of the hardware you( and most of the users of lightroom and other adobe software ) are blaming the banding on.

Nikoniser

Use DXO Optics ( free trial ) Prime noise reduction and Moire set high. Kills the noise stone dead.

There is a windows Build of Darktable, works well, I have tested it, kills banding dead.

Here is a shot that is about 6 stops underexposed, ( I didn't give my flash enough time to recycle ) that I have pushed 8 stops in DXO optics ( stops exposure + 4 stop shadow push ) , one is with noise reduction, one is without it. I have givena 100% of a brown leather sofa that is the darkest thing in the room.

original :

[url=https://flic.kr/p/G5nghc][img]https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1623/26303685455_a4b292397c_b.jpg[/img][/url][url=https://flic.kr/p/G5nghc]DSC_3964_no_noise-1[/url] by [url=https://www.flickr.com/photos/125129318@N06/]Piston Heads[/url], on Flickr

100% crop of brown sofa pushed 8 stops

https://www.flickr.com/photos/125129318@N06/26237424751/in/dateposted-public/

100% crop of brown sofa pushed 8 stops with DXO moire and prime noise reduction.

[url=https://flic.kr/p/FWczGU][img]https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1584/26211264352_5610012ce8_b.jpg[/img][/url][url=https://flic.kr/p/FWczGU]Noise_Reduced[/url] by [url=https://www.flickr.com/photos/125129318@N06/]Piston Heads[/url], on Flickr

spraynpray

@Nikoniser: Most of those links don't work...

Paperman

One can't just take a photo any way he wants with no concern for proper exposure and then complain about quality/noise in post-process.