Shooting D600 in monochrome

ben_v3ben_v3 Posts: 59Member
edited March 2013 in D6x0/D7x0/D8x0
So last night we went out for dinner and I thought that it would be fun to shoot in B&W. So I went to the Picture Control setting and changed it to monochrome. As I was taking the pictures, they were showing up in B&W. When I imported them to lightroom, they were all in color. A user on the PAD thread said to put the toning into B&W but when I checked it was by default already selected.

It makes sense that when shooting in RAW the color data is preserved, but how do you keep everything in B&W during import? Its easy enough to select the whole group and change them back to B&W. It just threw me off when they showed up in color.

Thanks,
Ben
D600 | AF-S 24-70mm 1:2.8G ED | AF 20mm 1:2.8 D | SB-800
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ben_v3/

Comments

  • MsmotoMsmoto Posts: 5,396Moderator
    When you shoot in B & W, I believe the options include various filters. However, the RAW data is recorded to the card directly and the effects may be in the RAW file, but appear only after conversion to B&W in post processing. A simple check would be to shoot with the second card recording JPEG. Then see if the images on this card are in B & W with the filter effect.

    I will try to check this out myself, but could not find the description in the manual. Great question....
    Msmoto, mod
  • CorrelliCorrelli Posts: 135Member
    edited March 2013
    You can't keep it in B&W unless you use Nikon Software. Other programs like Aperture or Lightroom cannot read the Picture Control settings of the RAW files. This is why they interpret them the best they know and this is color... :)

    If you shoot JPEG they should turn up in B&W as they are processed in camera
    Post edited by Correlli on
  • MsmotoMsmoto Posts: 5,396Moderator
    edited March 2013
    Thanks, Correlli. Does this mean JPEG files will be in color as well?
    Post edited by Msmoto on
    Msmoto, mod
  • CorrelliCorrelli Posts: 135Member
    edited March 2013
    No, if you set the Picture Control to B&W the camera will create the B&W JPEGs from the sensor data (the RAW file). Just like it applies all other Picture Control settings to JPEGs as well. So the JPEGs should show the settings, in this case they will turn up in B&W.

    If you open RAW files in Nikon Software it will also recognize and use the Picture Control settings and render the images accordingly. But other software like Aperture or Lightroom does not know anything about Picture Control settings and simply ignores them. They render the images they way they are told by Apple and Adobe.

    So JPEGs show what you selected in camera, RAW will show what the converter thinks is correct and ignores the Picture Control settings unless it is Nikon Software.
    Post edited by Correlli on
  • ben_v3ben_v3 Posts: 59Member
    Thanks for the very informative answer @Correlli!
    D600 | AF-S 24-70mm 1:2.8G ED | AF 20mm 1:2.8 D | SB-800
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/ben_v3/
  • MsmotoMsmoto Posts: 5,396Moderator
    Thanks, Correlli
    Msmoto, mod
  • kyoshinikonkyoshinikon Posts: 411Member
    Shooting B&W in camera is not like shooting film B&W. The Jpgs create flatten out your color info which often is important to control for an optimal digital B&W. It is better to hoot raw and pull out the saturation in post. You can shoot with B&W in mind tho
    “To photograph is to hold one’s breath, when all faculties converge to capture fleeting reality. It’s at that precise moment that mastering an image becomes a great physical and intellectual joy.” - Bresson
  • spraynprayspraynpray Posts: 6,405Moderator
    +1 kyoshi. I find I get nice B&W's by clicking the image to B&W and playing with the colour channels in LR too. I have heard that SilverEfex is good and I have seen some great results from it but I don't have it so....
    Always learning.
  • MsmotoMsmoto Posts: 5,396Moderator
    As Corelli pointed out, the RAW file has all the information. And this is what I shoot. In Lightroom 4.3, I then apply the filter I desire and it seems to work very well. The nice thing about this is one can adjust the filter effect in post.
    Msmoto, mod
  • CorrelliCorrelli Posts: 135Member
    When I know I will be shooting b&w I will also set the camera to monochrome but keep shooting raw. This way the image on the camera screen will be monochrome and give me a first impression but I still have the full raw file for PP.

    I use SilverEfex most of the time as b&w converter as it gives you a lot of options. The plugin can be used in Photoshop, Aperture or Lightroom and it also works stand-alone. It is not sold separately anymore but only as part of the Nik Collection. But they also have a 15 day trial version and some very good training videos on YouTube.

    As others have said almost any image processing software can convert a color image to b&w, it depends on you what workflow you prefer.
  • ben_v3ben_v3 Posts: 59Member
    After I imported to light room it was no problem playing with all the filters and getting what I wanted.
    D600 | AF-S 24-70mm 1:2.8G ED | AF 20mm 1:2.8 D | SB-800
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/ben_v3/
  • EricBowlesEricBowles Posts: 27Member
    The Monochrome Picture Control will display a B&W image in the LCD, thumbnails in some programs, and the image if the program honors Nikon settings. View NX2 (free)Capture NX2, and Photo Mechanic can be used to display the image and convert it to an alternate format honoring the settings. NEF+JPEG is a good way to retain the B&W image for review if your software does not honor the settings.

    While I might shoot using the Monochrome setting, it's not the best B&W converter. It's better to start with a color image and then convert it. Many of the selection control or smart select tools need color data for editing - and once you convert to B&W your editing options are more limited.
  • FlowtographyBerlinFlowtographyBerlin Posts: 477Member
    Just read until @Correlli's post, but just one question: Why would you want to shoot B&W in-camera, and not shoot normal and then do the conversion in Aperture, LR or whatever?

    Just curious, because I don't see any advantage and just disadvantages: You can easily just apply the same B&W conversion setting to a batch of pictures copy-paste style, and non-destructive, while in-camera it's destructive at no advantage.

    BTW, if you'Re not shooting artwork but casual stuff, you can definitely get very nice B&W-results from color JPGs.
  • mikepmikep Posts: 280Member
    yeah i dont see how "shooting in B&W" is even possible. it is just the camera applying 0% color saturation after the picture come off the sensor

    the world is in color, and the camera's sensor records that color .... just press the B&W button in your chosen editing program
  • VipmediastarVipmediastar Posts: 55Member
    Don't forget Leica sells an expensive bnw only camera. For bnw use Nik software. Silver efex
    www.vipmediastar.com
  • FlowtographyBerlinFlowtographyBerlin Posts: 477Member
    Don't forget Leica sells an expensive bnw only camera.
    Yeah but just because there's a company who figured out what people will give them money for, doesn't mean it's any better or, in this case, even makes any sense at all. (Maybe it does, but I don't know yet.)
  • CorrelliCorrelli Posts: 135Member
    If I know I want to shoot in B&W I do set my camera to monochrome. Having the pre-view image converted already does help me in some situations, especially when I did not shoot monochrome in a while.
    yeah i dont see how "shooting in B&W" is even possible. it is just the camera applying 0% color saturation after the picture come off the sensor
    As far as I know the default color to b&w conversion is using R:G:B in a 30:59:11 ratio and not just a desaturation, but this is just a minor detail.

    Well, thinking of it it is actually the other way round: the camera does not record a color image but rather three b&w images that are used to form a color image. :)

    But everybody has got his own workflow and as long as RAW is used we have all the options in PP.
  • TheGipperTheGipper Posts: 110Member
    I often shoot with my D600 with a view to rendering the images as B+W later. Usually just use LR and adjust the WB sliders and contrast. But knowing I want B+W does affect my judgement and choices about exposure and composition.

    Bubbles

    Plenty of examples on my blog if you follow the link under the pic on Flickr. :)
  • Rx4PhotoRx4Photo Posts: 1,200Member
    Just read until @Correlli's post, but just one question: Why would you want to shoot B&W in-camera, and not shoot normal and then do the conversion in Aperture, LR or whatever?

    Just curious, because I don't see any advantage and just disadvantages: You can easily just apply the same B&W conversion setting to a batch of pictures copy-paste style, and non-destructive, while in-camera it's destructive at no advantage.

    BTW, if you'Re not shooting artwork but casual stuff, you can definitely get very nice B&W-results from color JPGs.
    This has more to do with training your eyes to see in B&W at the moment of the click or better yet, before the click. The benefit of this is that you'll begin to better develop a vision of scenary in B&W instead of seeing everything in color and later thinking "what would that look like in B&W." Many educators in the area of B&W photography recommend that you shoot in B&W in camera to help develop this ability.



    D800 | D7000 | Nikkor 14-24mm f/2.8 | 24-70mm f/2.8 | 70-200mm f/2.8 | 35mm f/1.8G | 85mm f/1.4G | Sigma 35mm f/1.4 Art | Sigma 50mm f/1.4 Art | Sigma 50mm f/1.4 EX DG HSM | Zeiss 100mm Makro-Planar ZF.2 | Flash controllers: Phottix Odin TTL

  • FlowtographyBerlinFlowtographyBerlin Posts: 477Member

    This has more to do with training your eyes to see in B&W at the moment of the click or better yet, before the click. The benefit of this is that you'll begin to better develop a vision of scenary in B&W instead of seeing everything in color and later thinking "what would that look like in B&W."
    Ok, but that's only if you haven't shot in B&W before, then.

    Plus, also referring to what @Correlli said, the in-camera B&W conversion "develops" at a certain RGB ratio only. To me, monochrome always had the fascination of color filters - be it either when taking the picture, or – which I figured out at the late stage of my analog photography days before I went digital – when making monochrome prints from color negatives.

    I'd argue that especially when you're not familiar B&W yet, and with the look that each color layer produces for certain motives, it can be a great advantage to learn those things in post. Because then, you can really try everything out and learn to see the B&W result.
  • sunilthakkarsunilthakkar Posts: 1Member
    I think you guys are misunderstanding @Correlli here...

    He shoots in RAW - So all the colour information is there and he would process the image exactly how you do in Post Processing for the B&W Conversion... However, while shooting in RAW he turns his picture setting to B&W... this shows him a B&W image in his preview (on-camera) while he is shooting... This helps him better visualise in B&W...

    Now that does not affect the RAW image at all... So when he opens it in Lightroom he sees the same colour image you would see and processes just as you would...
  • spraynprayspraynpray Posts: 6,405Moderator
    I found that back in the day I would make the decision to shoot B&W before I left home and it depended on the genre of photography I was doing. I never thought 'Oh, that will look good in B&W I'll change over' - but then it was less convenient than it is now. I often still set out to photograph in B&W before I leave though, even though it is simple enough to make the change.
    Always learning.
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