Nikon Df General Discussion

WestEndBoy

Nor will they be buying a D800 for $3,000. In fact, I suspect that most D800 purchasers, like myself, are not professionals (if anyone has any real numbers on this, it would be interesting to see).

Donaldejose, you may be right, but like me, your view is an opinion and one, or both of us, is wrong.

Is the camera flawed? Sure it is. The lack of a second card slot irks me. But I find it difficult to dismiss the DF, especially when the video connects with what I have been feeling all along.

donaldejose

Yes, not all pros or all advanced amateurs, use only cameras with the same user interface. Some will shoot a D4, D800 and a Df I suppose. Some will even shoot Nikon and Cannon for different purposes. I suppose if you are doing something like weddings where you shoot the whole thing with two zooms and a macro it would be possible to have a Nikon set and a Cannot set.

Vipmediastar_JZ

i f i was to buy a second camera for my gigs it would be another d800. the df for going to the park, party as guest etc. but at the point for the occasional photo it will be the smartphone especially if the photo will wind up in instagram or facebook.

i liked the camera very much and more when i played with it. heck i even wanted to rent it but im better off renting another d800 as a backup.
I can't wait to see that youtube video when i get home.

rbrylawski

OMG!!!

http://fstoppers.com/the-fstoppers-nikon-df-camera-hipster-review


via admin

Um, OK.....I finally gave up after about 10 minutes. Seemed kind of dumb to me. Maybe since I'm a shooter, I could care less which camera people on the street like the look of, I just care how the camera works and takes a picture..........

Symphotic

First, I thought the Hipster video was a hoot. I wonder what kind of reaction he would have if he dressed in a suit and tie and carried the Df.
I actually played around with a Df in the store recently, and although I liked it, I can't see how I would use it for work, and it is too much money for a recreational camera. So as much as I liked it, I'm saving my money for another D800.

Ade

Um, OK.....I finally gave up after about 10 minutes. Seemed kind of dumb to me. Maybe since I'm a shooter, I could care less which camera people on the street like the look of, I just care how the camera works and takes a picture..........

LOL, that's the whole point of the video. The comparison test between the two cameras at the 10 minute mark is just classic…

bland

Great video, as all of Fstoppers videos are.

rbrylawski

Um, OK.....I finally gave up after about 10 minutes. Seemed kind of dumb to me. Maybe since I'm a shooter, I could care less which camera people on the street like the look of, I just care how the camera works and takes a picture..........

LOL, that's the whole point of the video. The comparison test between the two cameras at the 10 minute mark is just classic…

So maybe I'll finish watching it...........

Golf007sd

The entire "theme" was stupid and childish. I closed the window at 11 1/2 minutes had passed. It was a total waste of my bandwidth usage.

rbrylawski

The entire "theme" was stupid and childish. I closed the window at 11 1/2 minutes had passed. It was a total waste of my bandwidth usage.

I kind of felt that way as well, but since I didn't go past 10 minutes, maybe the end was more substantial than the goofy beginning.......

Golf007sd

@rbrylawski: Not sure about the ending. But, this was to be "comical" it was far from it..IMHO.

rbrylawski

@rbrylawski: Not sure about the ending. But, this was to be "comical" it was far from it..IMHO.

I kind of agree..........

donaldejose

Actually, I would say "well done;" a parady on the Df retro styling being a case of "looks" over substance.

Ade

Yup.

Thom Hogan has a new article, "Nikon Has a Big PR Problem":

http://www.dslrbodies.com/newsviews/nikon-has-a-big-pr-problem.html

It was published before the F-Stoppers Df video came out, so I guess Nikon has an even bigger PR problem now…

Maybe someone in Nikon HQ will finally wake up. Or not.

Golf007sd

The "camera" itself was totally irrelevant to those the "jack-ass want to be" was showing them too. In short, the targeted audience had no clue about photography, the camera, the manufacture, or the like. Substitute the Df with the following bodies: Hassalbad-Stellar or Leica M9 Titanium and you could have ended with puzzled faces as the noobes scratching their heads about which they would have chosen. If he wanted to see their eye's pop, he should have mounted a D4 and 1Dx to that POS bike he was riding on the freeway and show his "audience" the prices and see which they would have gone with, when compares to his iPhone.

@Abe: "Anyone that's followed my Web site knows I've been tough on Nikon for two decades now."

From a pure marketing perspective, can you think of any other camera that has gotten as much attention than Nikon's DF over the past few months? How about Nikon itself? The biggest news coming from the Canon's D-SLR world is a photographer using a different body? Oooh boy now their is something new...right? 8-|

Ade

Golf I think you're just making Lee's point in the video.

"The targeted audience has no clue about photography".

His point, exactly.

When prominent Nikon loyalists like Chase Jarvis and Lee Morris choose to publicly criticize and ridicule the Df, maybe Nikon should pause and take note.

TaoTeJared

@rbrylawski: Not sure about the ending. But, this was to be "comical" it was far from it..IMHO.

I kind of agree..........

The video should be renamed "The Review that Represents Everything Wrong With Photography blogs. I'm cool because I hate what others want, and got you to click on this."

I find all the dismissive comments of why people should not would want the camera and then to only show that everyone would choose it over the standard dslr, illustrated the guy's snobbish arrogance towards shooters unlike him, and anyone who would want it. He came off as nothing more than a pompous a$$h**)# to me. I didn't find anything amusing or informative about it at all. The only thing I found interesting; he didn't try to find another photographer to have their thoughts on it.

It seems that everyone who is uninterested in the DF creates arguments why it won't work for applications that clearly it was not designed for, and believe they made a valid point. Sorry but no. The premise is incorrect, because important or relevant aspects of what it was designed for, and intended use, was ignored. Making an argument that a screwdriver doesn't make a good hammer would be just as valid.

The camera certainly has a niche market, just like the X100, Leica, Zeiss lenses, and medium format systems. To bash it for that, is absurd and childish.

Ade

Kai's review, for those who may have missed it:


DigitalRev.

Golf007sd

Any video done by Kia should be taken with a grain of salt. A great majority of their their reviews on products are conduct as if they are on some form of illegal substance...they too are not funny or stimulating. Case in-point, this one with Chase Jarvis...sense you happen to mention his name Ade. Soooo educating and entertaining....right. Again waste of one's bandwidth usage.

Lastly, the Df is targeted at a specific audience of Photographers. Not just some Tom-Dick-and-Harry walking down the street who have the NO clue about photography itself. I have a feeling if "the jackass" had asked his participants what an F-stop is they would be looking up to the heavens.

Elvishefer

Case in-point, this one with Chase Jarvis...sense you happen to mention his name Ade. Soooo educating and entertaining....right. Again waste of one's bandwidth usage.

A waste of your bandwidth, perhaps.

I actually liked this one and thought Kai did very well given his resources. The point of that particular series of DR's is that it's possible to get close to good looking, high production value shots with little more than a camera and persistence. Good material and inspiration for people who can't afford top of the line gear and crew.

donaldejose

Sounds like some Df "fanboys" here who are too touchy about someone making fun of a camera they like. Lighten up. Not all "reviews" have to be technical or even substantive. Some can be a parady expanding on a bit of truth about the product. Lots of legitimate reviewers have panned the Df as more style than substance in that the "retro" look does not improve functionality and is just there to look "cool." That is a legitimate point and can be the subject of a parady. The whole point of the reviewer changing his appearance and dress to look more "hip" and be a "hipster" is exactly what many say Nikon did to the D600 to create the Df. Funny with a bit of truth. Ever watch Saturday Night Live?

WestEndBoy

Saturday Night Live? Is that a tv show? I haven't owned a TV since the early 90s.

TaoTeJared

Sounds like some Df "fanboys" here who are too touchy about someone making fun of a camera they like.

It is not that people can't take a joke about a camera, the issue is that f-stoppers video (and many who continually condemn the camera) has nothing to do about the camera but is an attack on the people who they think will buy it (which is quite a ways off mark.) The complaints are just with having to learn something a bit new with the dials, and then it is all about it not being a traditional Nikon DSLR body, less ergonomic, smaller battery, and not the highest end AF. These are the same jackwagons who have reviewed mirrorless after mirrorless body saying how good and innovative they are by adopting the "retro" designs.

Think of it this way; It would be just as if someone crated a video saying, "The only people who want a DF are retired money grubbing lawyers who have nothing better to spend all their pinched money from clients on than this." And did so while driving around in a convertible Mercedes/Lexus/Rolls Royce, lighting money on fire and with the back seat of the car full of golf bags, expensive gilded toys and three 20-year-olds in the back seat waving waving a DF around. Then walking around a golf course asking people which camera they would choose. And then people piling on saying, well yeah it is just for those rich pricks - no one else in their right mind would buy it.

Apply some sort of that version of a story to every sub group - Nerdy computer programmer who can't get laid who wants "chicks" so he buys a camera. A drab color clothed, unshaven, smelly guy with some European accent who is is acting snobbish and like they think they are better than everyone else in the world. A slow talking cowboy picking one up and saying "My grand daddy had one like this, and that is all I need to know," and someone saying "they must be dumb, they can't even talk at a normal speed and that drawl? What a moron."
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I am far from being a hipster (whatever the hell that is) and I can acknowledge the short comings with any system (I own a X100 for Pete's sake) but I don't see the point in belittling anyone who would get one. It is the same as the visceral disgust and loathing people post about Leica owners. All the arguments have nothing to do with the camera other than "it doesn't have the newest stuff" and it's price.

If the D610 had the 16mp sensor in it, everyone would be raving about it and the only drawback of the AF and Meter people would say "well they can't have another D700 stealing D3 sales fiasco, it makes since." And everyone would say, "I wish it did, but yep, they couldn't do that again."

To me that is the obvious element about most of the people who complain; they really wanted a $1,500 D700 replacement and got the $3,000 DF. Their dreams of a D700 replacement have finely had the last nail driven into that coffin and that is why they are pissed. D700 dreams are finely dead. Boo frick'n hoo. Yep, all of you yuppie amateurs are just going to have to keep crying into your domestic beers - losers.

(How you like them apples?)

WestEndBoy

Some very good points TTJ.

Perhaps unintentionally, I think the F-stoppers video has pointed out one of the strengths that drive consumer tastes and its importance. Many of the arguments and tones in this thread are eerily similar to the tones that I hear in the Mac vs PC debate or similar product debates.

Is the DF overpriced? Maybe, but if it sells, then definitely not. Even then, some "black body" fanboys will dismiss that with, "Well it is overpriced, but the noobs that buy it are too dumb/rich/ignorant/amateur to realize that they have been had."

Will it change your style of photography? Yup.

Does it take good pictures? Are you kidding? If you argue that the DF does not take good pictures, then you have to argue that the D4 does not take good pictures.

And if your response to the above is, well there are more to pictures than image quality, for example it has the D610s crappy auto-focus etc., then you are saying the D610 does not take good pictures, but then let's face it, then the corollary of that argument must be that every DX does not take good pictures.

And let's not forget that we get to play with our D800s and D4s because Nikon makes cameras for everyone and makes a profit from everyone. If they forget about everyone but us D800 and D4 and Dxxxxxxx snobs, then Nikon will go out of business and then what will we do?

And finally, let's let history be the judge. I roll my eyes at critics that say Nikon should do this or that but have no idea what Nikon's long-term business plan and strategy is, do not know what goes on in the boardroom, are not the engineers having to make the tradeoffs and ARE NOT PUTTING THEIR OWN MONEY ON THE TABLE. Frankly, in this world, if you are not putting money down, you are just background noise. If you do put money down, then you deserve a voice (investors put the most money down, customers put money down, but get a very small voice as the individual amounts are small and there are lots of other consumers to outvote you).

donaldejose

Sorry guys. I just don't see it that way at all. I have read and viewed perhaps every review of the Df and they all are about the same: great sensor at half the price of a D4 but the retro design is a clumsy interface which doesn't advance the ability to produce a photograph and amounts to no more than just a "cool" or "trendy" look while other 'retro designs" have been more successfully integrated into a digital camera. None of them criticized or made fun of Df buyers. The f-stoppers video was a parady. Laugh at it; don't get angry. The guy changed his look to be "hip" to parady Nikon's changing the exterior of the Df to look "hip." That's all. He is not saying only people who dress or act like that will buy the camera. He is exaggerating for humor just like Saturday Night Live. He interviewed non-photographers who will never be in the market for a Df because he was researching how the camera looks to non-photographers; not how the camera works for photographers. He was testing the appeal of the look of the Df and the impression it creates to the general public. His one comment about how it works was simply that it slows him down in producing photographs, why would a serious photographer want that? That is a valid point and has been made in many reviews. In my view this guy is not making fun of the people who will buy this camera. Quite surprising to me is how many non-photographers did think the Df looked far superior to the D800 when I think the reverse is true. The strong negative response from some here who viewed the video suggests to me they are people who desire a Df and somehow think this video is making fun of them because they have that desire. That is just not true. Buy and use whatever tool you like. Take this from the video: a surprisingly large portion of the non-photographer population will think you are somehow "cooler' or "more stylish." I guess it is like the car, or motorcycle, you drive. A lot of people transfer images the vehicle creates in their mind and apply that image to you. I had not thought the difference between how a D800 looks and how a Df looks would mean 2 cents to most people in the general public.