5 Reasons you Need a 50mm Prime

Photobug

+1

My eyes were also wide open on the above image. This photo really supports his case.

MikeGunter

Hi all,

@PitchBlack - I'm not sure what the gentleman was getting at, perhaps his rule of thumb is always trying to shoot at the 'sweet' spot - it was clear to me either, but then, I also read things I've written and feel like I've scratched my fingernails over a chalkboard.

We all occasionally say things badly.

I don't think you meant what you just wrote either - at least, exactly as written.

It would mean that there the lens in question - when I think you mean that the 24-85mm actual T stop loses 4.5 stops. It (as a lens) loses 2/3s of a stop wide open. The 85mm 1.4g's loss goes to T1.7. Oddly my older model 85mm f1.8mm goes to T1.9.

Frankly, I'd give the youngster a break. He's only been in the biz for 30 years.

My best,

Mike

TaoTeJared

I know a pro who used the 18-70 and 18-200 and a D70s & 3 SB600s and two cheap studio flashes up until a year ago for weddings. Then they upgraded to a D7100, added a SB910 and still use the same lenses. Almost everything is shot at F8. They do 25 weddings a year and their images are truly great. I have seen them create images (out of the camera) @f8 that I truly find hard to believe but they know how to space out backgrounds and utilize the zoom to make the DOF look much narrower than what it actually is. And the images are always tack sharp.

They have been shooting @ ISO200 film/digital and @ F8 for decades and they never really saw the point in upgrading anything as they never saw any real improvement until the 24mp sensor. I appreciate what Pistnbroke is saying even if I scratch my head by the thought of it.

It is just a style that goes back to a time where choices just were not available so one learns how to compensate for what is available. It is a comfort zone and not a bad one either. No reason to berate or claim they are not "a real photographer" because of their choices of how they shoot.

TaoTeJared

The discussion could go around how a zoom can achieve the same/similar results rather than suggesting that to become a sophisticated photographer one must agree that you need a 50mm.

tcole1983

I guess what I don't understand is the whole always shooting at f8. I have had a number of lenses zooms and primes. My current lenses I almost always shoot wide open unless for some reason I need additional depth of field. So yeah probably if you shoot at f8 it doesn't matter if you shoot it with a variable aperture zoom or f1.8 primes, but who does that? I can't be the only one that thinks the bokeh and focus is great on the 105 f2.8 @ f2.8 or 300 f4 @ f4. I even shoot my 35 f1.8 wide oepn. There isn't much point (although I do think the pro lenses perform better not considering dxo and just use) if you don't utalize the widest apertures.

Oh well what do I know.

Pistnbroke

If using a bag of lenses gives you pleasure and or profit then its right.If using one zoom gives another photographer pleasure and profit then that is also right . Neither senario is an error or wrong. I shoot hundreds of photos and never change a setting on my camera ,the control wheels are taped up . A camera is like an M16 ..you point it pull the trigger and it does its job ..Just an extension of your arm not something to continuously fiddle with ....Photography is what you want it to be and if you are a pro and making money and have happy customers then its all good.
Tao ..I thank you for your comment ,insite and understanding..spot on.

[Deleted User]

You use "digital" for processing speed, that is all, It has nothing to do with lenses

Question, who hires an expensive photographer for the wedding with his camera taped on ISO 200 and f8 and tells you, that is the only way.

If I only had f/8 and ISO 200 film, sorry ASA 200 (almost forgot), on my camera, I did not had at least 60% of my photo's from my 30 years of (film) photography because I simply could not make them, they all should be underexposed by 3 stops. Is there a need to explain this on this forum?

That is why I use my 50mm f/1.8 too, so I can make photo's in the dark, the D600 with the 50mm on it fits in my bag as a walk around combo and it is a super lens for 169.- euro.

What I also read here is, if you don't want to switch lenses, buy a DSLR ............, what??

In 2001 after 30 years of film I bought my first digital camera, the Fuji Finepix6800Zoom, fixed lens and in 2003 the D70, to use my lenses again. Everything I even could not dream off, became possible.

Maybe something for a new topic, how to be creative, or just make photo's, with the camera taped on ISO 200 at f/8 in the dark, without a studio full of light of course.

Pistnbroke

Who said Iso 200??..ever heard of auto iso??? They dont put it in the handbook but did you realize that when you turn on your flash the iso goes to 4x your base setting ie 100-400....works great
And another outcome from this friendly discussion ..different lenses different colours/contrasts etc ...oh no we cannot have that . To get consistant colours throughout a shoot you need constant RAW to JPEG processing .Thats in camera and Large JPEG basic of course. Most of the sharpness you all keep on about comes from haveing your picture control set at +9......
You live on your planet and I will live on mine.
I suggest Ton you read your own tag line...
Those who say it can't be done, should not interrupt those doing it!

sevencrossing

ever heard of auto iso???
.

You would be surprised at the number of photographers who haven't
and to honest, till I joined NRF I did not realize it worked on M
unless I am using a tripod or flash, I now use AUTO ISO all the time

Msmoto

50mm prime lens….maybe we need a thread on "Auto ISO"?

heartyfisher

I was wondering why there were so many posting is this 50mm thread .. maybe i was missing out on something .. ;-)

donaldejose

Actually, Pistenbroke raises a very interesting shooting method, auto ISO, which we never discuss here on NR and it is worth some consideration. PitchBlack likes to shoot a f1.4 and I love his results but I think that method is limited to "fine art" work or portraits and would lead to far too many missed focus shots at events like weddings. Under the right conditions I would like to try his approach but It will require a subject that doesn't move, at least for me to achieve and keep focus at f1.4 or f1.8. Remember the old saying "f8 and be there." That saying didn't exist for no reason. Today, I would modify it to "f5.6 or f8 and be there" because often f5.6 is the sweet spot of a lens. Now lets put some of this together. Set your shooting mode to Manual. You are covering an event and you want to shoot your lens in its sweet spot which you know is f5.6 or f8. Set the lens to that f-stop and leave it there. Now consider the movement of the subjects you will be photographing. What shutter speed do you need to stop that motion? If people are moving slowly you may be able to use 125th of a second. Set your shutter speed to 125th of a second and leave it there. Now two parameters are "frozen" and you could indeed tape over your command and subcommand dials. But how are you going to get the correct exposure in changing light? Auto ISO. Consider the highest ISO you will tolerate. With a modern Nikon FX body I suggest that will be in the range of ISO 3200 and even up to ISO 6400 if you are not going to print larger than 8 x 10 inches. In DX you will probably top out at ISO 3200, but this is a personal preference. Set your auto ISO to go from the base ISO of your body up to the highest ISO you will accept. This is going to give you a 5 to 6 stop range of light in which you can photograph. If you are shooting outdoor events or outdoor family photo sessions the above settings should work fine. If you are shooting in a church you may need to drop the f-stop to f4 or f2.8 depending upon the available light. You can use a light meter to see how many stops of light you need to cover and what lens aperture you will need to be able to do that at the shutter speed you need to use. All this can be done just prior to the event being photographed. Use spot, center weighted or matrix metering; whichever you prefer. Now you should be set to cover the event without stopping to change your settings. Concentrate on capturing the moment and let the automation built into the camera do the work of getting the exposure right. If you are using a zoom lens you can zoom to wide to increase apparent DOF and you can zoom to telephoto to decrease apparent DOF by blurring out the background. It is an interesting style of shooting events which I think is more possible than ever because of the latest generation of bodies with good high ISO. One can even use your preference of in camera high ISO noise reduction setting to deal with higher ISO and your preference of in camera Active D-Lighting to reduce some highlights and fill some shadows. Personally, I think this is a very good shooting method which should work well in many situations and I do intend to try it just as I intend to try PitchBlack's method. I also think the Manual/Auto ISO method could work well with models when using constant lighting rather than flash: set the f-stop for the look you want (f1.4 is fine); set the shutter speed as low as you can go (probably 1/60th of a second in this situation); let your ISO vary and use your exposure compensation dial for a high key or low key image.

I would like to learn more about how Pistenbroke works and see some of his images (instead of just attack him because he is using a method different than most of us). We can disagree without personal attacks.

MikeGunter

Hi all,

@donaldejose - Thanks for the positive words...

"I would like to learn more about how Pistenbroke works and see some of his images (instead of just attack him) because he is using a method different than most of us."

I'll even take back those evil things I've said about you.

Except those lawyer things. ;-)

My best,

Mike

donaldejose

Mike,

If all humans behaved themselves and treated each other with kindness we wouldn't need lawyers. No prosecutors, no defense counsel, no civil trial attorneys, no contract attorneys. The number of attorneys in a society is inversely proportional to the civility of the society. The Amish live near here and don't use lawyers. They believe it is against the Bible to fight with each other like that. Instead, they take their disputes to the minister or to a group of elders for resolution. They also don't like to deal much with what they call "the outside world" or "the English" because we won't agree to settle our disputes with them in the same way.

I understand some animal testing laboratories have been discussing changing over from testing on rats to testing on lawyers. They see an advantage in that lab workers would develop less affinity for the test subjects. But they also see a disadvantage in that rats are more similar to humans.

There was a small town in the Midwest which had only one lawyer and he was starving because he didn't have enough business. Then a second lawyer moved into town and suddenly there was enough business for both.

I understand SquamishPhoto recommends that Pistnbroke sells his 30,000 images through "Smug-Mug." Sorry about that last one. Not meant to be a personal attack; just a lighthearted play on words used in the thread.

)

MikeGunter

Hi all,

@donaldejose

I wouldn't have made the joke if I thought for an instant you would take it seriously. My eldest daughter is married to an attorney - a former lab test subject himself.

My best,

Mike

Msmoto

I was under the impression the thread was about 50mm lens…..

But, one point is always valid. If we do not post images, but instead just share opinions, it makes it difficult to asses one's validity.

Now back to the lens discussion…..

donaldejose

pistnbroke: Please explain your technique further in this tread

http://forum.nikonrumors.com/discussion/2794/what-when-werediscussion-of-the-use-of-auto-iso-settings#Item_4

and post some photos for us illustrating how this technique works for you during weddings. I would be surprised if you could shoot at f8 inside a church.

Pistnbroke

Seem to have a split here between those who understand and those who dont
Like the man said I would like to learn more about how Pistenbroke works and see some of his images (instead of just attack him because he is using a method different than most of us). We can disagree without personal attacks.
I think the reason I get banned is the american perception of rude or attack ..in europe we dont see it that way its just debate. If you look at the vast intervention of moderators on Nikonites ( mentioned here already) you can see why many left and set up Nikonzen which has not attracted the cranks and "whats an F stop" of many sites. In fact this forum has attracted high calibre members tired of argument.
Most of you still dont understand that auto iso is not only auto iso but auto shutter speed as well ..outcomes the sun and the iso drops to 100 and the speed goes up ..go into the dark and the iso goes up (to its max) then the speed goes down....majic these computers.... bet most of you dont understand 1/320 FP either and what it does for you ......
Its photography lots to learn and lots of ways to skin the cat .
One rule I dont break is sites who dont support images as attachment clearly dont want any images so I dont post any ..got 60,000 on Zenfolio not interested in photobucket etc ..your loss.
Have fun click click ...

Golf007sd

I humbly ask that we respect each other's style of photography; and the gear he or she wishes to exercise in the process of taking a picture.

I have removed some posts that felt crossed the line. Moreover, if this tone continues to get unhealthy further action will be taken in addressing it.

Thank,

Your humbled moderator.

spraynpray

Whoa! The posts previous to this are no longer relevant to my post so I've deleted the old text.

snakebunk

@pistnbroke: Please, start a new thread and tell us more about your style of shooting. I spent the saturday night away from keyboard and missed the deleted posts. The thread doesn't make any sense now.

About the 50mm, I would like to have one but I think I would be better of with a 35/1.4 and an 85/1.4. Or do you think that all three focal lengths are needed? Currently I don't have anything below 150mm. When I don't shoot birds it is mostly architecture, statues, books and paintings.

Pistnbroke

New thread has been opened ..put a great long post on it ..I dont do architecture so I should not comment ...start a thread and ask....

snakebunk

@Pistnbroke: Great! I am a manual shooter and would like to learn more about the automatic modes.

studio460

I used to hate the 50mm on FX (yeah, that's why I own three of 'em). Then I noticed a lot of my full-body shots taken with an AF-S Nikkor 24-120mm f/4.0G VR were shot at 50mm! My AF-S 50mm f/1.4G is no sharper than my old AF 50mm f/1.4D (maybe even a bit softer). My third 50mm, the Nikkor 50mm f/1.2 Ai-s was originally bought for cine applications, but now it's reserved as an "effects" lens. I would love the new Sigma 50mm f/1.4 or Nikkor 58mm f/1.4G, but I think three's the limit. Anyway, since noticing the full-body shots' focal lengths, I've now gotten really interested in shooting a 50mm prime again.

WestEndBoy

You mention the 50mm 1.2 Ai-s. I like that lens. I like the effect it has when shooting wide open. At F2 and above, it is the sharpest 50 in Nikon's lineup. When I am hiking, I carry it with my other two manual focus lenses and use it along with them for landscapes.