Reasons Why Professional Photographers Cannot Work for Free

MikeGunter

Hi all,

@Ade & @Msmoto - I had a Harley Davidson dirt bike (really I think it was made by Ducati). It was a hoot. And a lot more interesting and meaningful than any discussion of 'what it means to be a professional?'

Shift the conversation to really useful how to make it today, then you got a table to put something on.

My best,

Mike

Ade

How to make it today... I have no idea, really!

But I have a few stories to share.

A husband-wife photography team I know of retired a few years ago -- after purchasing their dream $$-million cottage to spend their summers in.

They made their money shooting clothes for catalogs -- static, without models. Carefully folded shirts. Pants, hanging on racks. Coiled belts. Stacks of bras. Shoes, arranged on a white background. An assortment of ties. That sort of thing. They work crazy long hours before each "catalog season", probably shooting thousands of items of clothing and clothing accessories.

That is what they did, for many big clients, for decades. Pretty specialized. And profitable.

Another photographer I know of has become a sought-after stylist for ice cream shoots. Turns out, you can't use real ice cream on ice cream shoots (they melt, among other problems). She's booked months ahead for her services. Yes. As an ice cream photography consultant / stylist.

I owe my product-photography knowledge to a young Toronto photographer. For awhile he's known as "the beer guy" since -- you guessed it -- he shoots beer bottles. And beer cans. See that Coors ad in the magazine? He probably shot it. He has a special "beer kit" with a zillion kinds of fake ice. Fake ice cubes ($50/piece). Fake ice shards (different sizes). Fake frosted ice. He has a collection of "perfect" bottles he collected over the years. (Your typical beer bottle has too many imperfections). He even has a special technique to shoot beer labels (so the colors come out right).

Beer photography, how's that for specialization? He's since branched out to other beverages (he shot a campaign for Coke Zero for instance); photographed many car ads for Mercedes-Benz and Nissan; shot creatively arranged boxes for FedEx etc. -- he even shot some of Nikon's Coolpix ads. But you're not likely to find him shooting a corporate headshot or booking weddings. He's a product specialist and he's very good at it.

My friend Nish, an emerging photojournalist (and fellow adventure-motorcyclist) is becoming well known for his coverage of Syria. It's tough, tough, tough work. But again, he's very good at what he does.

So I'd have to agree with @MikeGunter, as always, on the need to specialize. Pick your niche, it's up to you.

Then be the best at what you do.

Jack of all trades, master of none.

Msmoto

Mmmm… are all the "old folks" now online….LOL?

Holly Farm's Chicken in the 1960's…. along with some others… and we used the real food but it was "prepared" in a ay which made it inedible. We always did research and lots of preliminary recon work for the final shots…. all of course because of the high budgets we worked with. None of this work could have been done for free.

And, at nearly 72 I still go out and ride my Suzuki DR650. Not quite as quick as the Hayabusa I had a few years ago, but fun….

One of the facts of life when discussing free photography is quite often one gets exactly what one pays for it. My free photos being the exception... )

sevencrossing

This is about why Professional Photographers Cannot Work for Free

Some of you have said there are exceptions e.g. Charities
My experience is, reputable registered charities do not ask professionals to provided goods or service for free.
They often have, well paid, profession fund raises, who will drive a hard bargain but if you are a genuine working professional, they are happy to pay for a Professional job . That said, they will also welcome retired professionals who volunteer their services

Fritz

You know, at the end of the day, the only thing that really matters is that you get paid. And when you can get paid enough year after year then you've got it figured out. I see no reason to give my skills away. So only on the rarest of occasions will I donate my time. If people don't like that then they can pay the same dues that I have over the last 44 years- and then they can do the work for themselves.
If I'm working for free for you, then I can't be doing Ham radio or photography for me, can I?

ThomasHorton

My experience is, reputable registered charities do not ask professionals to provided goods or service for free.

I think that depends on the charity. Some big charity taking in millions of dollars a year, sure, what you wrote is true. But not all "reputable registered charities" are that big.

The dog rescue organization I volunteer for is reputable and registered, but since 100% of the money we take in goes toward medical expenses for the dogs and puppies, there is no budget for anything else. Our charity does ask professionals who are associated with the organiation to consider offering up their professional services. We have accountants, lawyers, carpenters, and yes, even photographers willing to donate their professional time and services because they are closely associated with the mission of the charity.

We seldom ask any professional not already associated with our mission to donate their time.. but we have on occasion. Very few professionals have turned us down.

SquamishPhoto

Then be the best at what you do.

Jack of all trades, master of none.

Nailed it. :]

TaoTeJared

This is about why Professional Photographers Cannot Work for Free

Some of you have said there are exceptions e.g. Charities
My experience is, reputable registered charities do not ask professionals to provided goods or service for free.
They often have, well paid, profession fund raises, who will drive a hard bargain but if you are a genuine working professional, they are happy to pay for a Professional job . That said, they will also welcome retired professionals who volunteer their services

When it comes to Charities and non-profits, it's about 50/50 on who has money, and who doesn't. I've picked some of that work up (with the one's with money) and I do enjoy working with them. I get hit up by people I know to volunteer "services" for the non-profits that can not afford to pay and I did some of that early on and found it in all honestly not very rewarding and very nagging-ly demanding. They are great causes and the people are great but it is just a different group usually with a less appreciation for people's time and the work involved.

Fritz

From a practical perspective, how much work is enough? Do you work 40-60-80 hours a week? Without down time you get tired, you get stale, and "burn out" really does happen. You just can't work for everyone and that means you begin to choose the clients and the commissions that pay enough to sustain yourself . I'm not working for the good of humanity, I'm working for the benefit of me. Most people simply don't understand the difficulties of being a self-employed small business type. So before I choose to expend what at my age is admittedly limited energy I need to be sure of a reasonable profit. Even back in the day when I owned my ambulance company I still needed to limit my pro bono work in order to stay profitable. So why can't photographers donate their services? Its just not in their economic best interest to do so.

Vipmediastar_JZ

My uncle learned to play the Vihuela (small guitar) for Mariachi Music. He played/practiced until he mastered it and that made him a Proffesional/expert.
His sole income was playing with a Mariachi making that his proffesion.
He is also a fantastic cook. When my family opened a Restaurant just before the economy went under he was our main chef. Shortly sadly the resturant closed but people would line up to eat there when he was on the clock.
He was not A proffesional Chef he was just a good cook and he got paid to work in the restaurant.

I know that for him his craft and true love is Mariachi. He is a singer but currently plays for the official Mariachi that Plays on Univision. He was hired for his expertise on the Vihuela.

I know that he can not play or work for free because he won't be able to pay the rent let alone put gas in his car to make it to his next gig. That is why any proffesional whose proffesion or main job is to provide that expertise to the client can't work for free. Maintence costs, equipment costs etc.. It all adds up.

He does however serenate my wife and I on our anniversary or when we visit him he gets the Mariachi to "practice" in front of us and he cooks for everybody.

In Mexican culture Mariachi at weddings and Funerals are very common. He has played for me for Free at my parties and he has Played for free (charity if you will) at both my grandparents Funerals with a whole Mariachi.

Now coming back to photography I don't consider myself a proffesional yet (see my sig). I want to be a proffesional working fulltime as one. Art is my calling and so is music but I don't have the patience to stay still. I rather walk and explore with a camera. I enjoy landscapes I enjoy anything photography and I rather do that than what I do know except I can't because my job is great and has great benefits plus I'm not an expert yet. I still have to learn more on photography I need to setup all kinds of lights in all kinds of scenarios. I need to learn to frame better, be less shy and on top of all of that I need equipment and working for free that makes my bank account go low.

Thats why as a Master photographer in traing I can't work for free. I will never reach my goals and when I do I wont be able to possibly have a good income if I'm known as the he will do it for free photographer. Off topic- A friend of the family offered my dad to do window work at 50.00 a window. My dad declined because well he is working on a temp agency and can't afford it. The point is that the friend needs to feed his family of 5 too.

Sure sometimes I ask certain people if they can volunteer when I get new equipment. When I bought the sigma 35 I asked a friend if she could volunteer and she showed up with her fiancee and a few months later they booked me for their wedding (paid).

I have asked makeup artist to get a few promo shots (hasn't worked out great yet maybe because they are friends and family).

I have asked my cousin to shoot his little league game so that I can get some practice shooting sports to get enough to build a portfolio to send to ESPN.

Well thats my vision and thoughts.

ThomasHorton

I can understand why you would not work for free.
I, however, don't understand why you would be offended by being asked to work for free.

What is offensive about being asked a question?

She asked, if you would work for free. The answer should "no". No need to get offended.

sevencrossing

Being asked to work for free, I do find offensive, but my reply will normally be No
what I, and I think PitchBlack finds offensive, is that we might find a credit an acceptable form of payment

Bokeh_Hunter

@PitchBlack - maybe it is where you live, but in different parts of the world many business work for "credit" or trade services. Many use it as a way one can avoid taxes (or reduce them significantly.) Usually it turns out to be a very good deal for both parties. It is not unusual or offensive to be asked to trade services especially from start-ups. It is rather normal in many parts of the world. It is a real childish and arrogant reaction you have chosen to take especially from a new company just asking a question.

sevencrossing

fair exchange is no robbery, but I would rarely consider a credit, a fair exchange
incidentally, in the UK, credit it is still taxable
and should be declared

Msmoto

I do believe that cultural norms exist in our world and while some find questions offensive, others do not. There are some bean counters (business people) who are always looking for "free" services so as to keep their bottom line as low as possible.

Then we have my smarty pants remark such as "Of course i will work for free as long as you comer all expenses." And of course, equipment rental is a bit pricey in this situations, my per diem for room and board is basically at double government levels and the end result is they will pay for services.

A lot of folks ask a lot of questions which are IMO inappropriate. It is easier for me to simply answer the question and avoid any negative interaction as my experience suggest this requires more energy on my part than I want to put out. I have a 20' x 30' print on aluminum on display in a restaurant and many folks have wanted to purchase it. That is, until they find out the "discounted" price is $1200.

Oh well…..

sevencrossing

That is, until they find out the "discounted" price is $1200.

Friends always ask for a discount
I really like the idea of a "discounted" price of over $1000 for a print

am I going to fall foul of "copying your style" if I do the same

SquamishPhoto

@PitchBlack - maybe it is where you live, but in different parts of the world many business work for "credit" or trade services. Many use it as a way one can avoid taxes (or reduce them significantly.) Usually it turns out to be a very good deal for both parties. It is not unusual or offensive to be asked to trade services especially from start-ups. It is rather normal in many parts of the world. It is a real childish and arrogant reaction you have chosen to take especially from a new company just asking a question.

Its one thing to point out that perhaps you've noticed a regional difference in your area, but to suggest that its childish and arrogant for PitchBlack to have a different standard for his work is actually incredibly rude. And to assume that your rather narrow and localized perspective is something that we should all adhere to is absurd. If someone wants to use your digital property to make money then you're just a sucker if you think working for credit is a wise course of action.

SquamishPhoto

It is a real childish and arrogant reaction you have chosen to take especially from a new company just asking a question.

Please. My credit in a brochure is of zero value. Nobody will see it and nobody will care. If you think that this is payment for hours of work, be my guest and give your work away. Giving your work away only perpetuates the pervasive and obnoxious belief that photography has no real value and that offering your name on some crap piece of nothing that nobody will see and nobody will care about is less payment than a stick of chewing gum.

Besides, my taking a stand and dressing the woman down actually caused her to respect me more as a hard-working professional as opposed to just some dude with a camera. She has apologized profusely and insists that she loves my work and wants to use me on several assignments. She has also purchased $600 worth of photos.

Being a sap leads to disrespect and a dimunition of your skills in their eyes. Once they know they can get you to work without paying you, they'll be loath to ever want to pay you in the future.

+1

bland

I agree with PitchBlack but I know many pro photographers that shoot for free but only outside of the venues they make their money from, never shooting for free in the venues that make them money.

Point being, I share the pit at concerts with top model photographers at times only to have their pictures of the concert show up in the newspapers and mags for photo credits, just to get their name advertised.

MikeGunter

Hi all,

@PitchBlack

Mind you, I make it a habit of overdelivering. If we agree to 10 photos, I'll usually deliver 15, and I'll usually do it in less time than agreed to. Technically, I am giving them things for free, but it does tend to build stronger relations.

It would seem that 'Overdelivering' is another way of saying 'working for free' that you don't mind. ;-)

My best,

Mike

MikeGunter

Hi all,

@PitchBlack

Perhaps you can see a difference, but some may quibble - giving the equivalent of 50% of your product away to make a paying customer happier - (one would ask than what? - a really, really happy customer?) might make those who are struggling to find their place in their market wonder why what schemes, to include gifting some part of their services seems so awful.

I don't think really care what your practices are - it likely works for you, but then other things likely work or should also work for others. You are really in no position to judge another's expectations in what they do.

Giving away work is a bad idea IMO, too, but crapping at others' practices isn't good form. Ever.

No matter how good your form is.

My best,

Mike

sevencrossing

I was taught on my first day at work ( over 50 years ago ) " exceed the client's expectations"
Something I always strive to do. I am not interested in "good enough "
IMHO, This is totally and completely, different from working for free, in exchange for a credit
With the best will in the world, a credit is not going to pay the mortgage
Exceeding the clients expectations usually results in more work and more $$$$$$$$

Photobug

+1 and nicely said @sevencrossing

Bokeh_Hunter

Besides, my taking a stand and dressing the woman down actually caused her to respect me more as a hard-working professional as opposed to just some dude with a camera. She has apologized profusely and insists that she loves my work and wants to use me on several assignments. She has also purchased $600 worth of photos.

Being a sap leads to disrespect and a dimunition of your skills in their eyes. Once they know they can get you to work without paying you, they'll be loath to ever want to pay you in the future.

That is called being an asshole for no reason and is a good example of the horror stories I hear from clients with people they worked with only once before I got hired. No one deserves that, and no one's work is above being asked a simple question. Acting like that is just flat out disgusting.

SquamishPhoto

Besides, my taking a stand and dressing the woman down actually caused her to respect me more as a hard-working professional as opposed to just some dude with a camera. She has apologized profusely and insists that she loves my work and wants to use me on several assignments. She has also purchased $600 worth of photos.

Being a sap leads to disrespect and a dimunition of your skills in their eyes. Once they know they can get you to work without paying you, they'll be loath to ever want to pay you in the future.

That is called being an asshole for no reason and is a good example of the horror stories I hear from clients with people they worked with only once before I got hired. No one deserves that, and no one's work is above being asked a simple question. Acting like that is just flat out disgusting.

Dude, this is another classic example of projection: you're actually the one behaving like an asshole right now. You clearly don't get the same caliber of clients that PB does and it seems lost on you that his treatment of that client resulted in secured future earnings and a more respectful and functional professional relationship. That you need to make that seem like a terrible and horrible thing makes no sense at all. But we've come to expect this from you, sadly.