The cost of doing business? Nikon keeps losing money and raising prices

SnowleopardSnowleopard Posts: 244Member
edited February 2015 in General Discussions
I guess this can apply to Canon as well, and I know people are going to bring up inflation of currencies and other stuff. Lets take a serious look at this, Both Nikon and Canon have been seeing profits disappear and they keep raising prices on bodies, lenses, accessories, etc.

Maybe the free market is speaking. Raise your prices and we will stop buying with so many choices for camera's out there. Lets face it. Is there that much more R&D between an F6 ($2599) or a D4s($6499)? I don't think so, and apparently consumers don't think so either.

I don't remember what the F100 sold for new, but is a D300,D300s,D600,D610,D750,D800.D800e,D810 really worth the spread from $1499-$3399?

Look at the lenses also..... I forgot if it was Tonika, Tamaron or another manufacturer, but they are putting fluorite coatings on one of their new lenses and the price is still reasonable. Nikon added fluorite to the 400mm F/2.8 and it cost something like $3000-$5000 more than the version with out fluorite?

Really?

Sometimes I want to know what the people in high and mighty positions at these companies are thinking. It's too late when companies loose their footing and can't become profitable again.

Another example of this is the housing market in the US.... the banks created a bubble, the bubble got to big and eventually the bubble popped and took allot of people with it. There were some communities that held their value, but now that the large bubble is repairing itself, the other little bubbles in the rash are getting ready to pop in communities that were not affected to the same level as the worst hit areas.
Post edited by Msmoto on
||COOLPIX 5000|●|D70|●|D700|●|D810|●|AF-S NIKKOR 14-24mm f/2.8G ED|●|AF Nikkor 20mm f/2.8D|●|AF Nikkor 50mm f/1.4D|●|AF-S NIKKOR 50mm f/1.4G|●|AF Micro-Nikkor 60mm f/2.8D|●|AF-S Micro Nikkor 60mm f/2.8G ED|●|AF-S VR Zoom-NIKKOR 70-200mm f/2.8G IF-ED (Silver)|●|AF-S Teleconverter TC-20E III|●|PB-6 Bellows|●|EL-NIKKOR 50mm f/2.8||
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Comments

  • sevencrossingsevencrossing Posts: 2,800Member
    edited February 2015
    Simple fact of life cut your prices below production cost and you go bust very quickly


    My gut feeling there are too many players in a crowded market
    Nikon and Canon are very strong brand names
    expect mergers and buyouts with other players


    Post edited by sevencrossing on
  • funtagraphfuntagraph Posts: 265Member
    edited February 2015
    It's fluorite, at first.

    Are you also willing to accept a decrease of salary? That's what I read in your lines the wish for constantly lowering prices.. Every new development promises to make things better. It's on us to decide if it's worth to pay for. Most cars sold in Europe hardly will we used to their speed limit, but people still buy Porsches and BMWs. Actually, no one is forced to pay those prices. I recall times when a 500 mm reflex lens from Zeiss was about 15.000 DM = 8000 €. 1000 mm were 30.000 DM. At that times, to me it was the value of a year's work. Without food, house or transport costs.

    Loosing money, increasing prices and you forgot outsourcing to China.
    Post edited by funtagraph on
  • sevencrossingsevencrossing Posts: 2,800Member
    edited February 2015
    When I bought my first Nikon a Photomic FTN in 1969 it cost approx £270 (£4,100 in todays money)
    In 1969 people like you were moaning Nikons were too expensive and the end of Nikon was neigh

    Today, In the UK a D4s in cost £4497


    Post edited by sevencrossing on
  • IronheartIronheart Posts: 3,017Moderator
    If anything, camera makers should charge a premium for digital, because you no longer have to outlay for developing and printing. Shhhh, don't tell them :-$
  • funtagraphfuntagraph Posts: 265Member
    Yes, and higher resolution and larger dynamics and LiveView like large format cameras, how cool's that. We jus gave up the "fully mechanics, no batteries needed" concept.
  • sevencrossingsevencrossing Posts: 2,800Member
    We jus gave up the "fully mechanics, no batteries needed" concept.
    I think I prefer the "no film, no darkroom concept"
  • SnowleopardSnowleopard Posts: 244Member
    It's fluorite, at first.

    Are you also willing to accept a decrease of salary? That's what I read in your lines the wish for constantly lowering prices.. Every new development promises to make things better. It's on us to decide if it's worth to pay for. Most cars sold in Europe hardly will we used to their speed limit, but people still buy Porsches and BMWs. Actually, no one is forced to pay those prices. I recall times when a 500 mm reflex lens from Zeiss was about 15.000 DM = 8000 €. 1000 mm were 30.000 DM. At that times, to me it was the value of a year's work. Without food, house or transport costs.

    Loosing money, increasing prices and you forgot outsourcing to China.
    Actually many of us have taken a pay cut in the US over the lat 15 years. They print more money with out the gold standard to back it up basically de-valuing the US dollar.
    ||COOLPIX 5000|●|D70|●|D700|●|D810|●|AF-S NIKKOR 14-24mm f/2.8G ED|●|AF Nikkor 20mm f/2.8D|●|AF Nikkor 50mm f/1.4D|●|AF-S NIKKOR 50mm f/1.4G|●|AF Micro-Nikkor 60mm f/2.8D|●|AF-S Micro Nikkor 60mm f/2.8G ED|●|AF-S VR Zoom-NIKKOR 70-200mm f/2.8G IF-ED (Silver)|●|AF-S Teleconverter TC-20E III|●|PB-6 Bellows|●|EL-NIKKOR 50mm f/2.8||
  • NSXTypeRNSXTypeR Posts: 2,042Member
    edited February 2015
    You also forget that older digital cameras don't break once newer ones come out- just like the film ones.
    Post edited by NSXTypeR on
    Nikon D7000/ Nikon D40/ Nikon FM2/ 18-135 AF-S/ 35mm 1.8 AF-S/ 105mm Macro AF-S/ 50mm 1.2 AI-S
  • spraynprayspraynpray Posts: 6,027Moderator
    My first DSLR was an Olympus E10 in about 1999. With grip and batteries it cost me about £1200. I don't get your point at all. IMHO prices have gone down, not up. You can't compare digital with film.
    Always learning.
  • FritzFritz Posts: 140Member
    Perhaps the product line could be simplified, that is to say is it really necessary that nikon compete model for model with Canon? Certainly there's a bit of unnecessary overlap in some models like the 610-750. I am continually puzzled by Nikon's philosophy of withholding features from less expensive cameras so as not to "compete" with the D4s and the 810; would it have been a problem to give us an AF-on button in the 750, or a larger buffer, or perhaps 8fps? Sure, that might mean a few thousand less D4s' but how many more 750's would they sell? I guess the question really is would you be better off selling a finite number of professional cameras or would you be better off selling a far larger number of pro-sumer cameras like the D700? After buying two 750's I have the distinct feeling that as good as the 750's are, they're only 90% of what they might or should be. That is not going to motivate me to buy a D5, however.
  • BesoBeso Posts: 462Member
    @Snowleopard I think you are confused. Nikon's Imaging Products Business sales are declining but operating income is still in the 11% range and the most recent quarter shows earnings per share at $0.14. So Nikon is not losing money. It is true their financial performance is declining but I don't think it is attributable to rising prices. I suspect it is more attributable to the general decline of DSLR sales to the general public who seem more interested in cell phone cameras and instant uploads than quality photography. Nikon is not alone in the declining sales of quality DSLRs and lenses.

    Nikon has had some truly groundbreaking technology implemented during the past three years. Most of us Nikon gear owners are hoping for the best but realize the market is shrinking. Hopefully Nikon will take the necessary steps to ensure critical mass is maintained to enable support and continued development of groundbreaking technology.
    Occasionally a decent image ...
  • ThomasHortonThomasHorton Posts: 323Member
    And because I am one of those oh so annoying types that no one really likes being around:

    Losing - be deprived of or cease to have or retain (something).
    Loosing - It is rare to use the word Loosing. Loosening is more common and means to set free or unfasten.

    Yeah, and I wonder why I am not invited to parties any more. :P
    Gear: Camera obscura with an optical device which transmits and refracts light.
  • MsmotoMsmoto Posts: 5,396Moderator
    Maybe Nikon is "loosing" money......but not anymore...... :))
    Msmoto, mod
  • heartyfisherheartyfisher Posts: 3,172Member
    And because I am one of those oh so annoying types that no one really likes being around:

    Losing - be deprived of or cease to have or retain (something).
    Loosing - It is rare to use the word Loosing. Loosening is more common and means to set free or unfasten.

    Yeah, and I wonder why I am not invited to parties any more. :P
    LOL.. no I am sure its not that .. you did that with a lot of flare. ;-)
    Moments of Light - D610 D7K S5pro 70-200f4 18-200 150f2.8 12-24 18-70 35-70f2.8 : C&C very welcome!
    Being a photographer is a lot like being a Christian: Some people look at you funny but do not see the amazing beauty all around them - heartyfisher.

  • spraynprayspraynpray Posts: 6,027Moderator
    And because I am one of those oh so annoying types that no one really likes being around:

    Losing - be deprived of or cease to have or retain (something).
    Loosing - It is rare to use the word Loosing. Loosening is more common and means to set free or unfasten.

    Yeah, and I wonder why I am not invited to parties any more. :P
    Don't get me started: lens/lense/lenses, there/their, to/too, due/do, then there's the use of apostrophies - argh! England and America - two countries divided by a common language LOL! :D
    Always learning.
  • kenadamskenadams Posts: 222Member

    LOL.. no I am sure its not that .. you did that with a lot of flare. ;-)
    Flair, maybe? ;-D



  • ThomasHortonThomasHorton Posts: 323Member
    For me, it is Coincidence, Irony, and Hypocrisy. The words do not mean the same thing!

    That and Jealously and Envy. They are not the same!

    Note to self: Try decaf and deep breathing. :)

    Gear: Camera obscura with an optical device which transmits and refracts light.
  • NSXTypeRNSXTypeR Posts: 2,042Member
    You also forgot they're. :D
    Nikon D7000/ Nikon D40/ Nikon FM2/ 18-135 AF-S/ 35mm 1.8 AF-S/ 105mm Macro AF-S/ 50mm 1.2 AI-S
  • heartyfisherheartyfisher Posts: 3,172Member
    You also forgot they're. :D

    LOL !

    deep breathing .. .. yes it helps ... !!

    Moments of Light - D610 D7K S5pro 70-200f4 18-200 150f2.8 12-24 18-70 35-70f2.8 : C&C very welcome!
    Being a photographer is a lot like being a Christian: Some people look at you funny but do not see the amazing beauty all around them - heartyfisher.

  • DJBee49DJBee49 Posts: 133Member
    I have a friend who owns a 'T' shirt with "I am silently correcting your grammar" emblazoned on the front. I love it!

    The deteriation (this is the new form of 'deterioration' by the way) of the english language causes me almost physical pain. Lens has no 'e' on the end folks!

    We do need to remember though that many correspondents on this and other websites, are not native english speakers. They may. therefore, need to be congratulated for having the courage to write publicly in english and forgiven the odd linguistic slip.

    Deep breathing.
  • heartyfisherheartyfisher Posts: 3,172Member
    edited February 2015
    lol ! lense actually has an e !! ... deep breathing ... ;-)
    Post edited by heartyfisher on
    Moments of Light - D610 D7K S5pro 70-200f4 18-200 150f2.8 12-24 18-70 35-70f2.8 : C&C very welcome!
    Being a photographer is a lot like being a Christian: Some people look at you funny but do not see the amazing beauty all around them - heartyfisher.

  • MsmotoMsmoto Posts: 5,396Moderator
    edited February 2015
    Lense vs, lens...... more humor here:

    http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/27132943

    Who knows, maybe this is what Nikon discusses in their boardroom. Wow, the answer to why no D400...LOL
    Post edited by Msmoto on
    Msmoto, mod
  • DJBee49DJBee49 Posts: 133Member
    heartyfisher. First I have heard of it! Perhaps you could enlighten me with a dictionary reference? Are you thinking of 'lenses' perhaps? That has an 'e' right enough but the singular never has as far as I am aware.
  • framerframer Posts: 489Member
    Bottom line, businessman 101. They know what they are doing. No matter what they do, sales will fall off the peaks. You redo the formula to keep making a profit.
  • heartyfisherheartyfisher Posts: 3,172Member
    edited February 2015
    heartyfisher. First I have heard of it! Perhaps you could enlighten me with a dictionary reference? Are you thinking of 'lenses' perhaps? That has an 'e' right enough but the singular never has as far as I am aware.
    Almost every dictionary on the web has "lense". Its just that the most commonly used spelling is "lens" and "lense" is in the alternate spelling. I grew up in one of the colonial countries. We probably have even more traditional spelling conventions than modern England ! :-)

    http://www.thefreedictionary.com/lense
    http://www.merriam-webster.com/medical/lens

    Post edited by heartyfisher on
    Moments of Light - D610 D7K S5pro 70-200f4 18-200 150f2.8 12-24 18-70 35-70f2.8 : C&C very welcome!
    Being a photographer is a lot like being a Christian: Some people look at you funny but do not see the amazing beauty all around them - heartyfisher.

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