Z7-Z6 Lenses

donaldejose

Let me make a speculative suggestion based upon the evidence, announcements, statements and rumors we have heard so far. It does seem Nikon's best new lenses are S lenses and Nikon has not yet even started to produce their better f1.4 pro prime lens line which we can expect to be even better than the excellent f1.8 lens line. If the Z mount really does provide for optical excellence beyond what the F mount can provide we can expect Nikon's best future lenses to be S lenses and we all should began to make the transition from F to S lenses. The maximum ability extracted from these very sharp S lenses would be with a high megapixel sensor. Nikon has stated they will be producing a Z body equal to the D4 capabilities. I assume the reference to a Dx series body indicates it will have two card slots and built in vertical grip. Once we have such a body (lets just call such a Dx style mirrorless body the Z9 body for convenience) Nikon should make a variant with its highest megapixel sensor (say the upcoming 60 mp sensor) and call it the Z9x. That is the body we want to make the most use of the sharp S lenses. I have been a champion for a D6 and a D6x variant but really what I personally would prefer is a Z9 and a Z9x variant because of the superior S lens line. The needs of fast action sports photography can be fully satisfied with a 24 mp D6 alone where the lack of lag time with an OVF is important. The fact that there is some small EVF lag time is less important in the type of studio, portrait, still life, product and landscape photography a high megapixel sensor excels at and the advantages of EVF (what you see is what you get) are more important than is fast action sports. Thus, if I had to chose between Nikon producing a D6x variant or producing a Z9x variant I would choose the latter in a heartbeat. Might as well have the body style I like best pared with the best lenses Nikon will be producing. A high megapixel Dx style body is less useful when the sharpest lenses won't work with it.

donaldejose

New roadmap looks really good. Wish Nikon released a roadmap of the bodies.

mhedges

Yeah it does. 100-300 F4? Nice.

snakebunk

But no long tele primes on the roadmap.

donaldejose

Looks like the Z mount is allowing Nikon to produce 35mm, 50mm and 85mm f1.2 primes instead of f1.4 primes. They may have really great bokeh.

mhedges

snakebunk said:

But no long tele primes on the roadmap.

That makes sense to me. Long primes don't really benefit from the new mount. And for all the attention they bring they don't sell in big numbers. So it makes more sense financially to make them for the (much) bigger F mount user base. Z mount folks can always throw them on the FTZ.

donaldejose

The S line primes continue to be superior and a strong reason to purchase a Z body.

snakebunk

mhedges said:

snakebunk said:

But no long tele primes on the roadmap.

That makes sense to me. Long primes don't really benefit from the new mount. And for all the attention they bring they don't sell in big numbers. So it makes more sense financially to make them for the (much) bigger F mount user base. Z mount folks can always throw them on the FTZ.

When I need to by a new long lens it will not be an f mount. Actually, I can't imagine why anyone with limited resources would spend a lot of money on a new f mount lens today.

donaldejose

"I can't imagine why anyone with limited resources would spend a lot of money on a new f mount lens today." I can. I do agree with your statement generally for lenses up to about 200mm used for general still or slow moving photography. The exception is those who derive income from fast action sports or photojournalism or moving wildlife where the F bodies are superior to the Z bodies. The Z bodies still need to catch up with the F bodies in fast accurate AF. It will come, just will take some more time for faster read out sensors and more processing power. Also, as a practical matter if you needed a 500 mm f4 lens today you have no choice but to purchase one in an F mount. It may be 5 years before Nikon produces its super telephoto lenses in S mount.

NSXTypeR

Anyone see this on the main page?

https://nikonrumors.com/2019/09/05/new-2020-2012-nikon-nikkor-z-s-line-lens-roadmap-leaked.aspx/

Considering Nikon really only makes a handful of new lenses each year, it seems like Nikon really isn't planning on any FX lenses.

WestEndFoto

NSXTypeR said:

Anyone see this on the main page?

https://nikonrumors.com/2019/09/05/new-2020-2012-nikon-nikkor-z-s-line-lens-roadmap-leaked.aspx/

Considering Nikon really only makes a handful of new lenses each year, it seems like Nikon really isn't planning on any FX lenses.

You mean F-mount? I don't think so. The just announced 120-300 2.8 was not on the roadmap.

donaldejose

The announcement of an S lens line roadmap is not to indicate that F mount lenses are dead. It is to announce Nikon's commitment to produce a number of lenses for the Z mount bodies to come so that purchasers of Nikon cameras feel comfortable. Nikon is committed to a complete mirrorless system adequate for their needs and doesn't jump ship to Sony. That is the same reason for the recent D6 announcement with no specifics. Nikon wants people to stay with Nikon knowing their needs will be met in the future and not jump ship to Sony. As long as a D6 or D7 or D860 or more pro Dx bodies are viable Nikon will produce appropriate lenses to support them. We may well see the death of new F mount lenses and bodies but that won't be until we have a pro Z mount body and Nikon sees its prior Dx body users switching to the pro Z mount body. Maybe 5 years from now will be the death of the new F mount body and lens? However, considering the fact that the S lenses seem to be superior to their F mount counterparts across the board it does seem to me that it would be reasonable to start the transition as soon as Nikon produces a Z body adequate for your needs. The future is S and Z not F.

PB_PM

Nikon is in a difficult position, but rounding out the Z mount lenses should be high on the list of things to do. Other than some high demand F-mount lenses sales are flat-lining (go to the CIPA numbers on the main page if you doubt me, even mirrorless unit sales are down 14% from last year). The 120-300mm F2.8E F-mount lens has likely been in development since 2016-2017, so it might be the tail end of what we see for the F-mount. Maybe a 600mm F5.6E PF will come to, but I doubt we'll see much else.

Symphotic

Look for Richard Wong’s comparison of the 85 /1.8S on Youtube. I wasn’t going to order this lens as I have the 1.4G in this F.L., but now I’m looking forward to getting mine (later this week, I hope.)
What the heck, I’ll pre-order the 24 as well. I love 24 mm as a focal length, although I already have it covered in 3 different Z mount zoom lenses.

WestEndFoto

Good video Symphotic. I will add him to my faves.

One pet peeve I have is when people call an 85 a portrait lens. If you shoot portraiture a lot, like I do, then it is a good portrait lens - though I rarely use my 85 1.4G in favour of my 58 and 105.

But I am surprised how much I use my 58 and 105 for scapes, especially when I want to stitch.

I am looking forward to the 1.2 lenses and seeing how they compare to the 1.8s.

rmp

Am I alone? I use the 24-70 f4 for just about everything: macro, landscapes, portraits, sports, etc. I look at other Z-lenses, but I am having a hard time justifying the additions carry-weight and cost. I guess, I have reached my "good enough" level.

mhedges

I use it a lot too, but I do also use the 14-30 and 50. And for sports I find myself needing something longer so I use the 70-300 AF-P or 70-200 VRII.

WestEndFoto

Depending what you shoot RMP, it may be all you need.

Symphotic

WestEndFoto said:

...
I am looking forward to the 1.2 lenses and seeing how they compare to the 1.8s.

I think I showed you my Noct. 1.2 is probably very useful for your shooting, but I need edge-to-edge sharpness for what I do (mostly), so F/1.2 is not the best for me. Although I don’t do a lot of people shots, when I do, I like the 85 focal length.

85 is a little better than 70 for standing back but getting details. My original “trinity” of primes was 28, 40, and 90, but it has moved to 24, 35, and 85 over the years, with the 24-70 zoom being on the camera most of the time. (I agree with RMP, although for travel I’m keen on the 14-30)

Seeing as there is no Z mount 105 macro, I’ll be keeping my D850 for some time to come.

donaldejose

I don't know why people keep claiming the limited S lens available at this time compel them to keep using a DSLR with F-mount lenses when those same F-mount lenses can be used with a Z body? The Z body is not limited by the availability of S lenses; just use the FTZ adapter. That F-mount lens will be just as sharp on a Z body as it was on a DSLR body. Is anyone reporting serious compatibility issues?

Symphotic

donaldejose said:

... Is anyone reporting serious compatibility issues?

No compatibility issues so far.

Still, for convenience I keep the D bodies, especially for macro work and long lens applications. So my kit has split from one bag to two, or rather one (small) bag and a couple of tripods with D cameras on them most of the time. If I am on foot, as most of my work requires me to carry the camera for several hours at a time, I carry the Z.

mhedges

Z 85 1.8 reviews are starting to come in. Seems to have excellent sharpness and virtually no chromatic aberration. Opinions on bokeh seem positive to mixed. Only real area where it doesn't shine is in focus breathing, which is surprising to me - I thought that was a major design consideration for all of these lenses.

Ton14

@donaldejose With the use of the FTZ adapter sharpness is not the case. The big advantages of the FTZ adapter are that lenses without VR have the IBIS of the camera (3-axis), furthermore the use of VR lenses with all the VR switches is a little (very little) bit more complicated. The native Z lenses use the 5-axis IBIS of course.

No problems at all with compatibility.

NSXTypeR

Symphotic said:

WestEndFoto said:

...
I am looking forward to the 1.2 lenses and seeing how they compare to the 1.8s.

I think I showed you my Noct. 1.2 is probably very useful for your shooting, but I need edge-to-edge sharpness for what I do (mostly), so F/1.2 is not the best for me. Although I don’t do a lot of people shots, when I do, I like the 85 focal length.

85 is a little better than 70 for standing back but getting details. My original “trinity” of primes was 28, 40, and 90, but it has moved to 24, 35, and 85 over the years, with the 24-70 zoom being on the camera most of the time. (I agree with RMP, although for travel I’m keen on the 14-30)

Seeing as there is no Z mount 105 macro, I’ll be keeping my D850 for some time to come.

I'm kind of surprised there isn't a macro or other Z mount specific special lenses, like tilt shift or phase fresnel lenses. Maybe the move to mirrorless made phase fresnel lenses unnecessary?

It's kind of a shame that Nikon moved to mirrorless so quickly, I'd like to see what they can do with phase fresnel lenses in general.

Also, seems like a repeating theme... Nikon gets to the F6 and film SLRs die. Nikon makes a D6 and DSLRs potentially may die out. I doubt we're going to get a D7. If anything maybe a D6s, but that's likely the end of the line for high end DSLRs.

mhedges

NSXTypeR said:

It's kind of a shame that Nikon moved to mirrorless so quickly, I'd like to see what they can do with phase fresnel lenses in general.

This is sarcasm, right?

Seriously though - I'm sure we will eventually get PF Z lenses. As far as using PF elements in non-telephoto designs - that's an interesting thought. I wonder if we will get any.