d7000 and D7100 buying advice

Alvee

Hi, this is my first post here. I have been following the forum for months and it took a while to browse and read through all the pages :P. It has been a great help and at least I know something now which I can try to execute.

I am from a third-world country and am an engineering student. I have managed about 1500-1600 USD for my camera and lens buying purpose. I am very eager in this aspect and have been using my friends dslr (Nikon D5100) quite a bit. My hobby lies in mainly portraits, marriages and candid street shots. I have to choose between the d7000 and the d7100, mainly due to my counties availability (you wont believe it!!). Can you guys please suggest which should I opt for? Imean, is the d7100 worth the extra price over the d7000? Keep in mind that I might not buy another body for years to come.

Thanks and take care.

shawnino

I'd stick with the D7000 and get the 85mm f/1.8. I don't know your country's market, but that should bring you in on/under budget unless you're really getting hosed.

Why:

--great camera, great lens
--I don't see the 7100 as a massive upgrade over the 7000
--Yes there are improvements, but when starting a kit I think it's more clever to spend money on lenses than on bodies
--Nikon has been having birthing problems with a few recent bodies at launch, although it mostly seems to be an FX issue for now.

Best wishes.

heartyfisher

What lenses do you like? If you can work with primes without zooms then set of cheap old second had primess(say 85mm F1.8, 50mm F1.8 , 35mm F1.8 ) may be the answer. and go with the D7100.. I have the D7000 and it is great but I am thinking of upgrading to the D7100..I kind of like that 1.3 crop mode and the great 51 autofocus system. The high MP count also provides options of cropping in post .. in effect making a 50mm lens into a 75-100 zoom lense! :-) you can even crop further if you wish .. say 75mm - 150 mm (if you consider 12MP acceptable). My previous camera was 6MP and that was plenty good enough!

Having said that the 18-105 kit lens is not too shabby.. May be worth getting that till you know what other lense you want. Still, you may be able to squeeze into your budget a 50mm F1.8 AFD as well as the kit lense.

Alvee

thanks guys for the helpful reply. And you see, just a couple of comments are making me confused again ~X(.

@shawnino, thanks, I find your comment really particular and helpful. I also was leaned to the d7000, but was confused about how big a issue is the 51 point focus system? I have read great things about the 85 mm, but I was also looking for the 35 mm DX (the FX one in my dreams :P). I also think I should also get a zoom, what do you think about the kit? Is the 16-85 mm significantly improved than it?

@heartyfisher, about the 2nd hand primes, it kills me when you guys discuss about such things, because we have no market/scope for that here. All 2nd hand goodys run in the family of the photogs . AFAIK, I don't think I would think about the reach at the moment, telephoto is not my thing (but you never know :P). And that 50mm tops my list as its the one I can buy anytime, and happily

thanks guys,really appreciate the help.cheers.

shawnino

Alvee--while I've borrowed a D7000 and can confirm it's a noticeable improvement to what I own, my DX body is the older D90. D90 is fine for AF, D7000 felt well better. D7100 may be better again, but I don't know. So I'm not much help there.

I'm also no help when it comes to zoom lenses. I shoot primes. The two things I would say from your expanded round of comments are this, and you might well find it obvious:

--You very likely won't need both the 50mm and the 35mm prime; one or the other would do. If you can somehow test each and determine which field of view you prefer, that would be ideal. It's largely a matter of your personal preference.

--If you're going to be shooting in less than perfect light you really will want a prime for the larger aperture it offers. (Yes, a person could get by with a f/2.8 zoom, but that's well over budget.) You write about shooting marriages and doing candid street photography. I don't know about your country but in mine the lighting in churches can be a bit dodgy and it does start to get dark in the evenings (at least that last bit I think your country likely shares...). Being able to work near f/2 when I have to lets me get a lot of handheld shots I'd just have no chance for near f/4.

Alvee

@shawnino, your comments completely match my thoughts. I think I can clarify my confusions by dividing my options. Its a lot of permutations and combinations of the same items, that's where I am at actually.

1. Nikon D7000+18-105mm+85mm 1.8g
2. Nikon D7000+16-85 mm+35/50mm 1.8g
2. Nikon D7000+18-55+70-300 VR+50/35 1.8g
2. Nikon D7000+18-105+70-300 VR+50 1.8d
3. Nikon D7100+18-105+ 50 1.8d

Now, you see I don't want to look at both 50 & 35, these are my choices. Any idea on which would be best? Do you think I have any better option?

And yes, marriages are generally at night here, and mostly in party centers with not that adequate lights. That is why I have primes in all of them

Thanks and sorry for bothering you.

shawnino

It's never a bother. I hope more people will share their experience.

I can't comment on the comparative merits of the zooms. I hope someone else can do so, or point you to a thread where they are compared head-to-head.

I have tested the 85 1.8g and I thought it was a "wow" lens. I mean, just amazing. Great bokeh, very little colour fringing, vignetting perfectly controllable (I would claim "non-issue" on DX), very, very sharp for my use (I do not print large). I have not bought it because my old 1.4D suits me perfectly well. If you can put this lens in your bag on-budget, I think you'll be pleased.

I have not tested either of the 35/50 1.8s, same story: I have an old 1.4D from film days which doesn't get a whole lot of use but when I need it, it seems fine. (I'm hoping that by the time I need to replace any of this stuff, Nikon will have "f/1.2" and "AF" together at last...in the mean time, I'm enjoying not spending money)

Hope to see some of your work on PAD!

spraynpray

The 50/35 decision is easier than you think. What shots are you going to be using the 35 for? As it is 42mm equivalent, it is too wide for portraits and quite narrow for larger group shots. The 50 is 75 equiv. so it is OK for portraits of one or two people, but not great for much else you are shooting in my humble opinion.

racheldistad

This is something that I've been wondering about for ages myself..
I'm leaning toward the d7000, as its a tried and tested camera, and well above my current D3100, although I'm also debating a D90. Personally, I'd look at lenses first, body second, though. Thats what I'm to do, as much as the D7100/D600 tempt me

spraynpray

I wouldn't go from D3100 to D90 if I were you, whatever you decide regarding glass or body. D7K is worth it right now if you have a real problem with using the D3100.

racheldistad

Haha, that's exactly why I haven't decisively bought anything, I can't really justify it

KnockKnock

35mm vs 50mm: I love the 35mm f/1.8 and it's great at being the one lens I shoot all day, but I find my 50mm f1.4 gives me that more professional looking image more often. Especially for people, 1-3 people from the waist up. It's partly the shallow depth-of-field, but more the perspective - it's the just-right focal length. People just look better with it. Someday if/when I get a 85mm or 105mm, I may find those preferable, but for now, on a APS-C sensor, it's my go-to art lens - it's hard to take a boring snapshot that anyone/anycamera could take.

So as a bag goes, I guess I'd recommend the 18-105mm kit lens plus the 50mm f1.8G, since it's the value leader.

spraynpray

@knockknock: +1 to most of that.

" People just look better with it. Someday if/when I get a 85mm or 105mm, I may find those preferable,"

The 50 fl is good for groups as you said but when you get the 85 you will love the difference in perspective on individuals. 50 is just too wide IMHO.

Examples:

This model up close:



Same model a little further back is better:



Those pics taken with the 85 would have been better from a perspective point of view.

Msmoto

Maybe we need a thread on model photography.....I cannot see exactly the relationship of the images above to the 7000/7100 discussion.....but?
Oh, the 50mm up close is a killer....nose!

The second shot is very nice...

heartyfisher

1) 18-105mm : Good kit lense .. Nothing to sneeze at.. really good option for a first lense.

2) 85mm 1.8g : As shawnino says "wow" it is THE portrait lens for FX and DX. On DX its a little bit long but if you have the space its very nice.

3) 16-85 mm : The sharpest DX kit lense. I believe nikon released in response to all the "mumblings" that the 18-200 was not sharp enough. I think Thom Hogan recommended it for the D7100 to get the best out of that sensor. The bokeh is not the best at most focal lengths but creams right up at 85mm as if it was designed to do so ! Great portrait lens at 85mm sharp at all other.. barrel distortion at 16mm

4) 35 1.8g : I do not have this and not tested it. But the reviews are very good. it is The "Normal" lense for DX and its equivalent to 52mm. which means it is the most versatile prime lense. I personally prefer a bit wider (28mm == 42mm ) but...

5) 50mm 1.8g : I do not have this and not tested it.., reviews very nicely! I am keen to get my hands on one some day. on DX it is the portrait lense used for the functions the 85mm would be used for.

6) 18-55 : Good kit lense .. but I would go for the 18-105 which is newer and better i think.

7) 70-300 VR : probably teh best value telephoto zoom. Can even be used for wildlife photography esp with all the MP the cameras have these days you can crop a bit for more "reach"

With regard to your combination of options ..

1. Nikon D7000+18-105mm+85mm 1.8g
2. Nikon D7000+16-85 mm+35/50mm 1.8g
2. Nikon D7000+18-55+70-300 VR+50/35 1.8g
2. Nikon D7000+18-105+70-300 VR+50 1.8d
3. Nikon D7100+18-105+ 50 1.8d

I think with what you said you were using the new photography gear for, a 70-300 would seem pointless. But if you included it you must have a reason that you have not mentioned.
I am still recommending #3, D7100+18-105+ 50 1.8d although the 16-85 option is also nice.. I was considering getting this combination myself.. I still may.. ie sell my 18-200 and D7000 and get the 16-85 + D7100.

However, consider this.. I have an old 35-70 F2.8 that I use for portrait and event shooting. Exactly what you are planning to do. You can get one for reasonable prices second hand from adorama or BH. The problem is the coating is not as good as the amazing nano coating you get these days so it flares a bit and contrast is not the best.. but its "SHARP" especially at 35mm. But these weaknesses(features?) can work well for portraits! :-)

If you want new, the tamron 28-75 F2.8 may also be an option to consider..
Hope this helps..

PS: LOL sorry for giving you more options to consider(confuse you) :-)

heartyfisher

@knockknock: +1 to most of that.

" People just look better with it. Someday if/when I get a 85mm or 105mm, I may find those preferable,"

The 50 fl is good for groups as you said but when you get the 85 you will love the difference in perspective on individuals. 50 is just too wide IMHO.

Examples:

This model up close:



Same model a little further back is better:



Those pics taken with the 85 would have been better from a perspective point of view.

Were these taken with 50mm on FX or DX?

Msmoto

Exif shows D7000 for both of the images above...

Dredden85

@Alvee- I have the D7000 & Nikon 18-200VRII kit. I upgraded from a D5000. I plan to get a 50mm 1.8G. The 18-200mm is a great walk-a-round lens. I have had great shots from it and the versatility is perfect (for me). The 18-105 is great too but I prefer the reach of the 18-200. If you can, go to your local store and give them a try. Look through the Photo-a-Day thread. Good luck!

Alvee

@Dredden85, as I have hard some negatives about the 18-200 (no doubt its convenient), I am not eager to go for the reach as I feel I don't need it right now. Besides, it costs about 900 usd here, which I cant justify. And I feel hurt every time you guys tell about testing out lenses, because we don't have such privileges here .

Alvee

@heartyfisher, thanks for posting each lens property so nicely . I added the 70-300 because I thought of covering the focal length range. Its sad for me that I have no second hand market developed here from where I can get that particular lens. And besides, as its my first buy, I am quite reluctant in that aspect and also, I have my concerns over the QC of the third party lenses. Just as you said, I am having a hard time with my choices, but #3 is right up there . Thanks again.

Dredden85

@heartyfisher, thanks for posting each lens property so nicely . I added the 70-300 because I thought of covering the focal length range. Its sad for me that I have no second hand market developed here from where I can get that particular lens. And besides, as its my first buy, I am quite reluctant in that aspect and also, I have my concerns over the QC of the third party lenses. Just as you said, I am having a hard time with my choices, but #3 is right up there . Thanks again.

Alvee, #3 looks like a great choice to get started and for the type of work you want to do. The negatives about this lens (18-200) are minor. I am sure there are plenty of members that might think differently. All of my shots on the PAD with my D7K are with the 18-200VRII. Although, Sigma has had trouble with their focusing issues I would not rule out Tamron. I had owned the Tamron 18-250 3.5-5.6G. Wonderful lens that served me well for five years. My photos on the PAD with my old D5000 are with the Tamron.

What ever set up you choose, it will give you years of enjoyment and great shots. Good luck and I look forward to viewing your shots on the PAD.

candjmail

Will older (1986 era) AF lenses work with the D7000 or D7100? From what I understand, the autofocus mechanism should work but can't tell if the metering is going to be compatible. Anyone know?

Msmoto

@candjmail

Make certain the lens mount of the old lenses is compatible with the electronics of the newer bodies. My understanding is the lenses made prior to 1977 can damage the electronic contacts potentially unless converted. Google "Nikon lens conversions" and you will see John White's website who seems to know what he is talking about.

I plan on checking him out in a couple weeks when I am in the area.

Ade

There were no F-mount AF lenses until 1983, when two lenses designed for the F3AF were introduced (AF 80/2.8 and AF 200/3.5). These two lenses are only compatible with the F3AF and the F4.

The D7000/7100 should accept all other older F-mount AF lenses, but might have some difficulty when focusing at minimum focus distances.

Spot, center and matrix metering will work, but the focus distance information will not be available for 3D metering (requires "D" type lenses which weren't available until 1992).

heartyfisher

@candjmail

Make certain the lens mount of the old lenses is compatible with the electronics of the newer bodies. My understanding is the lenses made prior to 1977 can damage the electronic contacts potentially unless converted. Google "Nikon lens conversions" and you will see John White's website who seems to know what he is talking about.

I plan on checking him out in a couple weeks when I am in the area.

Cool.. He is quite a legend ! .. Grab a portrait or 2 ;-)

heartyfisher

Will older (1986 era) AF lenses work with the D7000 or D7100? From what I understand, the autofocus mechanism should work but can't tell if the metering is going to be compatible. Anyone know?

Say what you want about ol KR but his lens compatibility tables are great !