D7100

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Even jpgs straight out of the camera have banding, no editing involved. With Raw if I even look at the shadow control the shot is instantly unusable, same for ADL in camera. Its most noticeable in shadows, but I even get lines running through bright foliage and animal fur.

I regularly print poster size and I'm getting maybe 3/10 shots I can use at that size compared to probably 99/100 from my budget D5100 - I basically delete almost everything I shot for the day which is pretty heartbreaking :-(

I'm a wildlife photographer so the extremely low rate if keepers is a deal breaker- I can't exactly ask a tiger to do a run for me again :-)

I tried exposure bracketing of static subjects to see if I can get a decent shot, but I either get blown unrecoverable highlights or banding shadows - its like the camera has zero DR. The only option is HDR, and that obviously isn't an option for wildlife shots.

This is the first time I have ever seen banding in one of my shots - I didn't even know what it was...

spraynpray

I suppose you have tried the ol' two button reset?

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Yep tried resetting, playing with ADL settings, updated all my software (LR, PS, even tried the bundled ViewNX) in case it was software-related.

The only thing that worked was debanding in Nik Dfine. Just doesn't seem right that a A$1700 (don't get me started on Australian pricing...) camera would require Photoshop processing just to get a decent jpg - I must have got a dud.

Anyhow, I've returned it and its being checked out as we speak.

Thanks for the suggestion in any case...

spraynpray

Yup - seems to be a bonafide duff body. Send it back.

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Yeah just hope I end up with a good one, because I love shooting with it

DaveyJ

Using the D7100 and a "other" leading brand video camera last night on bonfire night scenes and the D7100 produced lovely results, the other camera could not handle the night scene properly, colors and details were way off, etc. The D7000 night video was definitely not as good as the D7100. Now to see how it does in very darkened scenes. I already know by the way that the D800 is superior in this regard to the D7100. But at the price difference.....that is why I bought the D7100 as soon as it was announced. Must say I am very impressed with the entire performance. One thing I have noticed if you think you have an important video scene coming up it is good to get the live view and video recording started a little early as the initial start up is rougher than the rest of the video. With editing as simple as trim to the good spots, this minor detail is corrected.

DaveyJ

Nikon D7100 just got RAW support with Mac a couple of days ago. The D7100 not being fully supported in all shooting formats is a mistake I would not like to see repeated in the D400. Another issue is that the reset to allow a single focus grid instead of the default style of letting the camera select here the point of focus is unacceptable to many photo pros. The D7100 brochure is NOT very good at this instruction and rental units do not get reset to allow the user to select point of focus. Results in many missed shots when the event doesn't allow for reshoots. Nikon Digital Support Line (1-800-645-6689 is cutting back on hours of support fro the Northeast USA and I assume other areas. This had been an absolutely great support. Trying to contact Nikon USA is on the other hand difficult at best and next to impossible on the average.

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an update for anyone wondering. The camera went back but Nikon have said there is nothing wrong with it, banding is normal for a D7100 when using high ISOs. Didn't think 640 was a high ISO myself, I frequently shoot at 1600 with the D5100 no worries.

Anyhow, its obviously not the camera for me. Bummer, its great to shoot with...

JJ_SO

Don't know which small-brain guy from Nikon told you banding to be normal (I wonder if Nikon support is allowed to admit failures at all?) but so far I never saw banding in my pictures up to ISO 12.800. Do I need new specs?

FlowtographyBerlin

@ads: I just read your last posts, not the ones before, but why didn't you just send it back to the dealer and got a replacement? That's the first thing I always do when there's something obviously off. Or were you already past the return period?

DaveyJ

I sure agree with FlowtographyBerlin: This D7100 sounds abnormal. Sounds like a birth defect camera to me. I shoot at ISO 640 more than any other setting. To begin with our cameras are set for speed situations as a default. If we are faced with a more static situation we can always drop back towards 100 ISO. This D7100 does NOT sound NORMAL. I think Nikon just refused to fess up to it!

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This is the reply I got from Nikon:

Dear Mr Adam,

Kindly be informed that we have checked and tested from our end, that the lines seen in the dark areas of the pictures are normal, and there is no issue with the camera. It is normal for noise or lines to be more visible as ISO setting increases

@flotographyberlin unfortunately I live in Australia so not only do I get to pay $500 more for the same camera body, I also don't have the same consumer rights as people in Europe or the states (not limited to Nikon, pretty much all companies rip us off the same way...)

As I said shooting wildlife I frequently shoot in pretty awful light, 1600 is almost a default setting in forests, and before this camera I didn't know what banding was. Unfortunately this body is useless to me and Nikon aren't replacing it :-(

I might try emailing another section of Nikon and see if I have any luck, but as they've looked at the camera already sending it back again will just get the same answer...

Pretty disappointing. I'll have to dump it on ebay and go back to the D5100. Nikon won't be the automatic first choice for the next upgrade if this is the kind of support I get :-(

JJ_SO

I agree it's a pretty disappointing reply.

I saw banding as well in ISO 12800 shots, but not before and non by ISO 1600. And those were in lousy light and just to see what it can do. But I also saw, the RAW converter can do some magic to noise and also to make the banding less obvious. To be clear, in the light I saw it doing banding, I could not recognize a thing in that darkness. I don't want to talk you back, but it's sort of a common thing that HR sensors do create more noise - how could those tiny pixels could receive enough light if not by amplification?

But I don't think, you tried other RAW converters - do you shoot RAW, anyway?



I'd call this also lousy light, it's done at ISO 4000. If I try to lift up the shadows, there is a sort of banding in because it is underexposed.

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Hey no worries about talking back @JJ_so - I was hoping its just me doing something wrong and I can correct it...

I shoot raw, and at first I thought it as a LR/ACR issue, or my processing. Tried the supplied ViewNX, as well as Rawtherapee and Darktable (the noise filters in RT and Darktable were the best of the bunch, but still not great).

So I tried using jpgs and you could see banding straight out of the camera no processing involved. I can shoot exactly the same shot with my D5100 no sweat - even shooting stupidly high ISOs I get noise and loss of detail, but no lines/banding.

It doesn't affect all shots, some its just in the shadows, but I've seen it in foliage in some shots too. What's frustrating is that I get back home and find some shots are just rubbish.

Debanding in Nik dfine reduces it a lot, but its still there and I can't find anything else that can get rid of it. The problem is I do a lot of big prints, and what is barely noticeable on screen is unmissable on a 1m diagonal print.

PB_PM

I think banding is a known issue with the new Toshiba sensors Nikon is using.

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I read the same theory on other sites @PB_PM - could very well be on the money...

Doesn't seem consistent across cameras though - there are many that rave about their D7100s and have zero issues while others (seemingly like me) get some bad results out of them.

All I know is the one I have can't consistently deliver what I want and Nikon aren't replacing it :-(

MrD200

This reminds me of what happened back in 2005/06 when the D200 first came out. It also had banding issues. FIrst Nikon denied there was a problem, luckily they later fixed it. Hopefully this will be another of those situations. But sheesh. What a pain those people are. It makes me want to punch...a tiny hole in a shoe box and make a pinhole camera, sell all my Nikon gear, and focus on picture taking.

JJ_SO

@ads I can't talk for or with the people raving about D7100, I was just surprised what it can do. I would not use it for prints in 50 x 80 cm size, when I need to shoot in lowlight. If it would be clean output and no crop, you'd get 230 dpi, but on one place there has to be a bargain, D7100 was new cheaper than the D7000 but has 50% more pixels.

There are people who even divide the higher pixel count of D800 to get better shots. I don't know your skills with de-noising, mine are pretty basic. I thought it is best to leave the standard setting in Capture One, but I learnt, those are not the best. I'd like to post them, but the parameters are set in German and right now I'm not certain of the translation.

But still, even with better D7100 noise reduction, I would prefer the D800 any time for big prints. For me D7100 shows more details in low and high ISO, but the ones in shadows are lost pretty soon.

spraynpray

I tried using jpgs and you could see banding straight out of the camera no processing involved. I can shoot exactly the same shot with my D5100 no sweat - even shooting stupidly high ISOs I get noise and loss of detail, but no lines/banding.

There is your answer: Send Nikon the same shot taken at exactly the same settings at the same time from both cameras. According to your posting, you would not see the banding in the D5100 sensor so they cannot argue.

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Unfortunately I already did that @spraynpray, all I got was a "lines at high ISO are normal" response :-(

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@jj_so yeah I'd love a D800, but out of reach of my budget unfortunately

My noise reduction skills(or should I say Nik Dfine's) are good enough to get sizeable prints out of even 10mp crops from the D5100.

Ironically I wasn't after more pixels, the reason I wanted to upgrade was to get a better AF system, the 11 point struggles to keep up with faster moving animals

JJ_SO

@ads sorry to put it this way: fast AF + big prints + high ISO = no DX - this equation goes for me. Until a certain level I can substitute tool quality with skills. What you are doing with D7100 would lead me to my limit of not only skills but also personal frustration.

What happens in aspects of banding, if you reduce resolution (M or S) and use JPG fine quality without NR? Did you already set the JPG from "unique file size" to "optimum quality"?

What happens if you change the output in LR to half size.

And last question: Did you try D7000 instead of D7100?

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Well I'm getting good quality prints out of my current DX, and I'm only using 400-800 ISO most of the time (1600 in places like the Bwindi Impenetrable Forest where there was basically zero light).

I just tried resizing raw files down to 12 and 10mp after doing noise reduction/debanding in PS. It reduces general noise and some of the banding, but it doesn't eliminate the banding altogether. Cheers for the suggestion though!

I considered a D7000, but thought a 7100 would be a better upgrade over a 5100...

JJ_SO

Don't blame the D5100 :> I still like it! Look at those so called Pro-bodies and tell me how to do overhead or close to floor shots without that fantatsic swivel display. It's sensor is the same league as D7000, it's reliable and lightweight. I don't give it away.

In my experience the D7100 is really not an exciting upgrade. If I had to choose between D7000 and D7100, I think I would stick with my good old D7000 although there are some improvements, but none which makes the D7k old iron.

PB_PM

Don't blame the D5100 :> Look at those so called Pro-bodies and tell me how to do overhead or close to floor shots without that fantatsic swivel display.

Three words, right angle viewfinder.