NIKON...MIRROR LESS NOW WITH FIRMWARE UPDATE

donaldejose

Remember, the iPhone is using the effect on a very small sensor, wide lens and a high f-stop. Software could be created which produces a much more subtle effect and your choices could be in f-stops like from one less f-stop to two less f-stops. So an f2.8 lens could be "reduced" or "opened up" to a f2 lens or to a f1.4 lens.

BVS

mhedges said:

Agree. They are pretty terrible. Did you notice how the bottom right corner of his weather station was blurred along with the "background"? And some of those dog pics looked like really bad photoshop jobs, where only the dog's head was sharp and everything else immediately went to bokeh.

Also on the 'f/1.4' weather station shot, the left side of the metal pole looks like it's been chewed away, and the black cups on the top should be blurred more (if you compare with the real shots) but aren't at all.

WestEndFoto

I remember a salesman telling me not to bother with fast lenses because I could reproduce the effect in Photoshop. I laughed out loud.

Symphotic

Three bits of good news today:

8:54 AM: My client sent me the PO for a job in December at which I can use the Z7 (The job more than pays for the Z7 as well as an excellent video system they are going to keep.)
9:45 AM: 35 mm lens shipped from BandH today (no delay due to the Holiday)
12:35 PM: Z7, Adapter and Zoom lens shipped from BandH.

I'll check in with you next week.

NSXTypeR

I think the one thing I'm concerned about is when Nikon will be making its last DX DSLR. I'm not sure if it's a bad idea or good idea to pick up the last version of whatever the D500 or D7200 is and just keep shooting from there on out or just pick up a new mirrorless APS-C Nikon.

Hopefully I'll have to make that choice later rather than sooner.

rmp

I have the Z7/24-70-f4. I also have the D850. In the past, I traded up very quickly. For me it was and is about new toys, it was/is not about $. This time, I will keep the previous generation (D850) for a while. I just trust it more, at this time.

Symphotic

rmp said:

... This time, I will keep the previous generation (D850) for a while. I just trust it more, at this time.

Same for me, but I purchased the Z7 as a second body to use as backup for my D850, as my D810 was repurposed. I didn't think the price was unreasonable at all.
After going through the camera for a day I could find no reason why this camera shouldn't be my main shooter when I am out and about and the D850 my second body.
I used to carry my F2 body and a couple of lenses in a small carry bag. I couldn't do that with the D8XX series because of the size of the body and lenses. I put the Z7 with the 24-70 f/4 mounted, the 35 mm f/1.8 and a 14-24 f/2.8 mounted to the FTZ all in the same bag as I used to carry. There are also a handful of batteries and some other essentials.
The Z7 looks like it will be my daily carry.

Symphotic

Wi-Fi networking update: My Z7 is connecting to my MacBook Pro without a hitch. As I photograph, both JPEG and NEF files are transferring to my "Pictures" directory. Also, as of today, Lightroom and Adobe Camera Raw are reading the NEF files.

With a direct connection, I could not use the same computer for internet. Also, I lost communication when I went to a room on the other side of our building. I reconnected through a router in "Infrastructure Mode" and I can now use this computer for access to NR and download NEF files.

It takes about 45 seconds to get a full NEF file and JPEG set from the camera to the computer.

You need the Nikon Wireless Transmitter Utility and the Z7 network guide from Nikon's download site.

I'm busy copying Kodachromes from the late 1940's and early 1950's. I was using a D850, but I think I'll do this on the Z7 and this file transfer over my router is very convenient.

PB_PM

45 seconds per file, yikes. How big are the files, because if it was say a 50MB file, that means the camera is tranfering only 1.1mb per second, which is simply horrible for WIFI unless the router is 15 years old. I'd be okay with that for a few shots, but if I was doing a big shoot, no way. I'd just pull the cards and put them in the computer, it would take less than 45 seconds, and the upload of the whole card would be 2 minutes rather than 2 hours.

Symphotic

PB_PM said:

45 seconds per file, yikes. How big are the files, because if it was say a 50MB file, that means the camera is tranfering only 1.1mb per second, which is simply horrible for WIFI unless the router is 15 years old. I'd be okay with that for a few shots, but if I was doing a big shoot, no way. I'd just pull the cards and put them in the computer, it would take less than 45 seconds, and the upload of the whole card would be 2 minutes rather than 2 hours.

Yes, you have it. The router is ancient was a freebee. The files are about 50 mb. I don't know if it is the router: it might be the camera wifi. The reason I say that is the 45 seconds is the same if I connect the camera directly to the computer though wifi or through the network using wifi.

I've done about 40 images today and the slowness of the wifi is not slowing me down, nor do I expect it to do so for my work.

The old Kodachromes look incredible, by the way. They are almost 70 years old and still vivid. 70 years from now, will anybody be able to read my NEF files?

Symphotic

It is an old, no charge router from my ISP, but I think the camera is the bottleneck. The transfer time is the same if I connect directly to the computer. It's plenty fast for my work, as it sends the photos over real time, and it takes me more than 45 seconds to prepare the next shot.

The old Kodachromes are amazing. Some are 70 years old but are still vivid and brilliant. I've got a gig this evening, but maybe when I get back I'll post a couple.

Will anybody be looking at my NEF files 70 years from now?

PB_PM

Unless serious data rot happens due to the drive not being powered for a long time (10+ years) someone very well could look at the NEF, if supporting software still exits. Will they? Who knows, about as likely as someone looking at your old slides. We had tons of old Kodachrome slides from my grandparents, but most got tossed because we didn’t know what the photons were of, and lacked any meaning to us (people and places we didn’t know). True for most personal photos, once the person is gone, short of great documentation, they don’t mean much.

Symphotic

I humbly anticipate that some of my photographs, like some of the Kodachromes I am digitizing, will be able to tell a compelling story without knowing who is in the picture. By photographing we are documenting events so that they do not cease to exist, even if memories fail.
The slides I am digitizing were taken by my late uncle. He was an accomplished amateur photographer and Nikon user, although these pictures were before he owned any Nikon. (He went on to become an important figure in the visual arts, and quite a collector of works by young artists and photographers.)
One of the last times I saw him, he was on his way to Mt. Everest with his F3: not to climb it, but to photograph the people and places in the area. THAT is a box of slides I wish I could find!

Capt_Spaulding

PB_PM said:

Unless serious data rot happens due to the drive not being powered for a long time (10+ years) someone very well could look at the NEF, if supporting software still exits. Will they? Who knows, about as likely as someone looking at your old slides. We had tons of old Kodachrome slides from my grandparents, but most got tossed because we didn’t know what the photons were of, and lacked any meaning to us (people and places we didn’t know). True for most personal photos, once the person is gone, short of great documentation, they don’t mean much.

I understand how this happens but it saddens me nonetheless. As generations pass along much history passes with them. A great uncle of mine ran an Indian motorcycle shop in Houston. During the 1920s and 1930s he sponsored many young flat track and TT racers. His shop walls were lined with pictures of the men and bikes. Foolishly, I failed to ask him for them when he sold the shop.

Similarly, my Dad took many pictures in the South Pacific from 1942 to 1945. Everything from troop ships to softball games to B-25s to incoming tracers. After his passing we managed to locate some of them but many were lost. The problem is that what is mundane at one time may gain importance later for reasons that are unknowable when the images are discarded. Not everything to be sure, but we really can't know with certainty in the present.

It's like we're irretrievably converting history from raw to highly compressed jpg. Lots of information is being lost and we may not realize the importance of what's been discarded or even know that we lost it.

PB_PM

While true, we simply cannot keep everything, space and resources are limited. Less of an issue with digital storage space, than physical things though. The reality is the stuff from average everyday people wont matter much in history, pictures of important people and big national scale events will be treasured, but family travel shots, which there are literally hundreds of millions or maybe billions, of the same location now days the value of individual ones becomes almost 0 unless the photo is of important people (world leaders, national figures etc), just as it has aways been.

Pistnbroke

Reminds me of a relative who did a lot of family history research ..when he died I asked his sister if she pulled the hard drives on his computer ..No ..all gone.

Vipmediastar_JZ

From a user post on FB "It you are looking to wirelessly tether to a Mac or PC, the Z7 can do that in the 802.11ac 5GHz band, and transmit a RAW L + JPEG FINE in about 8 seconds. Not possible on the 850 by itself, only supports 2.4Ghz. If you want to drop that to 4 sec, on either 850 or Z7 it’s about a grand for the accessory WT-7a and needed accessories."

This is actually neat. If it can be done wirelessly or usb c cable you save a bit with out buying other tethering hardware and software.

Pistnbroke

Now we hear of canon turning the 5D series mirrorless ...same body ? Same back focus ? Just junk the mirror ..is this a way foreword for Nikon ..D850 mirrorless ?

mhedges

So it would be an F mount mirrorless? I doubt we will see that, at least not in FF.

Anyway didn't they market the Z7 as a mirrorless D850? Which is probably not quite correct, but still.

Wonder when we will get more info on the Z6? Hopefully there will be some more test cameras out there soon, and maybe some press events.

ggbutcher

mhedges said:

Wonder when we will get more info on the Z6? Hopefully there will be some more test cameras out there soon, and maybe some press events.

That's the one I'm waiting to hear about. also. If procured, that would be my DX->FX transition. I'm more interested in more dynamic range than image dimensions. Also, lower cost.

NSXTypeR

ggbutcher said:

mhedges said:

Wonder when we will get more info on the Z6? Hopefully there will be some more test cameras out there soon, and maybe some press events.

That's the one I'm waiting to hear about. also. If procured, that would be my DX->FX transition. I'm more interested in more dynamic range than image dimensions. Also, lower cost.

Also, it makes me wonder when the D6 series is going mirrorless too. At least we have a little bit of time before that might happen since the D5 is fairly new.

BVS

Pistnbroke said:

Now we hear of canon turning the 5D series mirrorless ...same body ? Same back focus ? Just junk the mirror ..is this a way foreword for Nikon ..D850 mirrorless ?

The rumor is to replace the 5DS and 5DSR with mirrorless. Basically, a high res version of the EOS R, like the Z7 is to the Z6.

BVS

NSXTypeR said:

Also, it makes me wonder when the D6 series is going mirrorless too. At least we have a little bit of time before that might happen since the D5 is fairly new.

The D5 is actually more than two years old now and due for replacement.

donaldejose

Yes, but the Dx series two year "replacement" is just a "refresh" which is why it is designated an "s" model, such as the D3s and D4s. The full redesign gets the next full number, such as D4 and D5. So the D6 full redesign is not due until 4 years after the D5 first appeared in 2018 which will be in 2020. Only an "s" refresh of the D5 is due this year and may well be skipped if there is nothing important to add. 2020 is the year that the D6 will be out and that is when it may be changed to a mirrorless design.

mhedges

I'm not sure Nikon's mirrorless AF tech is quite there yet for them to release a mirrorless D# body. I'm guessing we get a DSLR refresh then mirrorless after that.