NIKON...MIRROR LESS NOW WITH FIRMWARE UPDATE

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  • Vipmediastar_JZVipmediastar_JZ Posts: 1,708Member
    Failure issues aside this is from the non pro model of samsungs SSD's

    "The 860 Evo addresses that issue by offering 150TB TBW on the smallest 250GB drives, and then doubling that number at each subsequent size. At 1TB the TBW is an impressive 600TB, and the 4TB mechanism has an incredible 2,400TB or 2.4 Petabytes TBW.
    Yes, we’ve got to the P-word. So long terabyte, hello petabyte!

    To put that in perspective; if you wrote the entire contents of a 50GB Blu-ray to the 4TB 860 Evo every single day it would take 131 years to hit the predicted failure point of the 4TB unit.
    This isn’t a claim we can practically test given deadlines, but it would strongly suggest that even with the smaller mechanisms the Samsung 860 Evo is highly unlikely to fail within the typical lifespan of a modern computer."
  • mhedgesmhedges Posts: 2,881Member
    So basically you can erase and rewrite 600x. I guess that would probably be fine for almost everyone? Doing the math gives about 1.28 million exposures on 64 gb internal storage for a 24 mp camera shooting 14 bit RAW lossless compressed. I don't know of all that many cameras that get used that much, or last that long.
  • PB_PMPB_PM Posts: 4,494Member
    Considering that there are several pro video external recorders that use 2.5" SSD's for storage, I think it could survive being used in a still camera. That said, even a 256GB M.2 SSD takes up a fair bit of space, when you consider how compact the newer camera designs are.
    If I take a good photo it's not my camera's fault.
  • Ton14Ton14 Posts: 698Member
    edited October 2018
    A card failure occurred to me one time with a CF card in my D70, 15 years ago.
    It never happened anymore, maybe because I update my SD cards to quicker ones and don't use the older cards anymore. Further the cards are much better then 5 years ago.

    Question, when a card fails I see it on my camera, so I can put another in.
    I dropped an SD card once and walked over it, but it worked fine after I cleaned it.

    How many card failers do/did we have?

    I prefer 2 slots, where one is backup, but don't mind one SD slot in a camera. I have a 200gb card in my phone and one in my tablet. My backup is now as follows:

    I have an USB 3.0 "On The Go (OTG)" stick with a SD slot on it in my pocket and can connect it to, USB-C, USB and mini USB. Bought it on Amazon DE for € 10.-. (Searched on OTG USB-C with sd slot).

    On the road I just copy my SD card to my phone or tablet and put an empty SD card in my camera. So I have now, one original, one backup on my 128gb CF card in the second slot from the D810 and one backup on my phone or tablet.

    PS. I can see my photo's on a bigger tablet screen and extra, the tablet can also send the photo's to my Synology DS218+ via WiFi or 4G+. Very simple solution. Oh, I also have a Xtorm 15.000 power bank with fast USB-C, but hardly had to use it.
    Post edited by Ton14 on
    User Ton changed to Ton14, Google sign in did not work anymore
  • SymphoticSymphotic Posts: 711Member
    I've had my Z7 for about 3 weeks now. It's more fun than a box full of puppies on Christmas morning.
    Jack Roberts
    "Discovery consists in seeing what everyone else has seen and thinking what nobody else has thought"--Albert Szent-Gyorgy
  • spraynprayspraynpray Posts: 6,545Moderator
    Symphotic said:

    I've had my Z7 for about 3 weeks now. It's more fun than a box full of puppies on Christmas morning.

    Hahaha! Good to hear Jack.
    Always learning.
  • SymphoticSymphotic Posts: 711Member


    Hahaha! Good to hear Jack.

    Here's the deal: I document products, hardware assemblies, and installation procedures with both photos and videos. I need a compact kit to get in and out of where I need to be, and because a lot of my work is at sea, I require rugged and reliable resistance to water ingress.

    I can fit the Z7, the close focusing 24-70 zoom, an Atomos recording monitor, a microphone with furry wind cover, headphones, cables and batteries all in a tiny FB-14 camera bag I've had for years. All I need beyond what fits in the bag is a tripod. The bag and the tripod fits into an over the shoulder carryon bag that doesn't scream "steal me."

    I don't use a pan head for video as I have a lot of extra frame space in UHD for zooms and pans to be done in post. Full frame UHD, and minutely croppable still images are perfect for what we do.

    My clients don't expect me to show up with a film crew and I probably couldn't get them through security anyway. This kit is quick and easy to mobilize, gets me on site without issues, and sets up quickly.

    I'm off to beautiful Vancouver BC on a job in two weeks (I'll try to do some sightseeing as well.) Next month we have the UK, and next year we have some work at sea and in Athens, Greece. Portability is a big plus for me.

    We still have our D850 and D500, but now they stay in the lab (or at home) and don't get the use they were getting. The D810 has gone off to product shots for a commercial website my son is running as a side job. I am teaching him everything I know about photography. (That won't take long...)

    People have said the Z7 is not a good value for the money. It is turning out to be money well spent as I can get everything, including several days clothing, into one plain black carry-on bag.
    Jack Roberts
    "Discovery consists in seeing what everyone else has seen and thinking what nobody else has thought"--Albert Szent-Gyorgy
  • rmprmp Posts: 586Member
    I agree -- the Z7-24-70f4 is rapidly becoming my travel camera. The size of the travel kit is a big deal. (Should that be small deal? :-)
    Robert M. Poston: D4, D810, V3, 14-24 F2.8, 24-70 f2.8, 70-200 f2.8, 80-400, 105 macro.
  • PB_PMPB_PM Posts: 4,494Member
    edited November 2018
    Symphotic said:


    I'm off to beautiful Vancouver BC on a job in two weeks (I'll try to do some sightseeing as well.)

    You are coming at the worst time of the year for sightseeing. We typically get 20+ days with rain in November, the pineapple express (storms that start off Hawaii) are already starting, so bring a coat and an umbrella. :(
    Post edited by PB_PM on
    If I take a good photo it's not my camera's fault.
  • rmprmp Posts: 586Member
    What size is the ISO-gap between the Z7 and Z6. I can read about the available settings, but they do not affect my actual setting. I set a maximum ISO so that I can eliminate the noise in LightRoom or Photoshop. What is the highest ISO setting you actually use (or will actually use) on the Z7 and Z6?
    Robert M. Poston: D4, D810, V3, 14-24 F2.8, 24-70 f2.8, 70-200 f2.8, 80-400, 105 macro.
  • PB_PMPB_PM Posts: 4,494Member
    Since the Z6 isn't shipping yet, nobody knows. If you want to guess something close, compare D750 and D850 samples.
    If I take a good photo it's not my camera's fault.
  • donaldejosedonaldejose Posts: 3,718Member
    edited November 2018
    According to the main blog post of Photons to Photos measurements of dynamic range it appears to me the Z6 sensor is tuned to give about one third stop more dynamic range than the Z7 above ISO 800. No much of an ISO "gap." But DR is not the only factor. I highly suspect high ISO noise reduction is more important and the final sum will be that a Z6 ends up having an ISO advantage of about one stop. That won't make much distance when you have enough light to shoot at ISO 200 (and produce a product which looks like ISO 100) but it will make a significant difference when you can shoot at ISO 12,800 and it looks as good as (or better than) ISO 6,400 on the Z7 or D850. I compared the Z6, Z7 and D850 at ISO 12,800 on the Imaging Resources comparometer. Open the full size images of the still life shot at 12,800 and move to the dark glass just above the Fidler's label. Notice the difference? I would say the Z6 give you a total of one stop better result at high ISO. Your opinion may differ.

    https://www.imaging-resource.com/IMCOMP/COMPS01.HTM
    Post edited by donaldejose on
  • mhedgesmhedges Posts: 2,881Member
    Z6 now expected to ship in USA on 11/16. Woo hoo!
  • rmprmp Posts: 586Member
    If Nikon fixes the focus problem, they will be the number one mirrorless provider. (The Z7 is almost good enough now.)
    Robert M. Poston: D4, D810, V3, 14-24 F2.8, 24-70 f2.8, 70-200 f2.8, 80-400, 105 macro.
  • mhedgesmhedges Posts: 2,881Member
    Well looks like the whole youtube camera/photography grifter crowd was in orlando for a Nikon Z6 launch event so we should see a lot more hands on reports soon.
  • WestEndFotoWestEndFoto Posts: 3,745Member
    rmp said:

    If Nikon fixes the focus problem, they will be the number one mirrorless provider. (The Z7 is almost good enough now.)

    What do you think the focus problem is? Continuous autofocus on moving subjects?
  • PistnbrokePistnbroke Posts: 2,444Member
    If Nikon fixes the focus problem and the price ….
  • mhedgesmhedges Posts: 2,881Member
    Price for what? Z7 is maybe a little high, but I don't see them pricing it under the A7RIII. Z6 price is pretty good IMO.
  • tc88tc88 Posts: 537Member
    Even for Z6, the equivalent A7II can be had for $1k now. Well, how soon they become in stock will tell whether it's priced high or not.
  • mhedgesmhedges Posts: 2,881Member
    tc88 said:

    Even for Z6, the equivalent A7II can be had for $1k now. Well, how soon they become in stock will tell whether it's priced high or not.

    Well tried the A7II at Best Buy just the other day and wasn't impressed. The EVF was pretty bad - very cartoony, and tons of lag/wobble when moving around. I sure hope the Z6/Z7 is better.
  • BVSBVS Posts: 440Member
    tc88 said:

    Even for Z6, the equivalent A7II can be had for $1k now. Well, how soon they become in stock will tell whether it's priced high or not.

    The only thing comparable between A7II and Z6 is maybe the AF. Z6 should best it in every other way. A7II image quality is actually worse than APSC at high ISO.

    https://dpreview.com/reviews/image-comparison?attr18=lowlight&attr13_0=sony_a7ii&attr13_1=sony_a7iii&attr13_2=nikon_d7200&attr13_3=nikon_d500&attr15_0=raw&attr15_1=raw&attr15_2=raw&attr15_3=raw&attr16_0=6400&attr16_1=6400&attr16_2=6400&attr16_3=6400&attr171_3=1&normalization=full&widget=1&x=0.3975800468009816&y=-0.06950730082828106
    D7100, 85 1.8G, 50 1.8G, 35 1.8G DX, Tokina 12-28 F4, 18-140, 55-200 VR DX
  • PistnbrokePistnbroke Posts: 2,444Member
    24 MP is not enough ..Z6 or A7r2
  • donaldejosedonaldejose Posts: 3,718Member
    Hopefully an AF fix can be done with software updates over time. Time for Nikon to copy Tesla on improving existing products with software updates. Not just fix bugs; actually improve the products and add new features like eye autofocus. Nikon software is already identifying the face why not add another step and identify the eye?

  • tc88tc88 Posts: 537Member
    BVS said:

    A7II image quality is actually worse than APSC at high ISO.

    FF Sony sensor worse than crop sensor at high ISO? Common sense will disagree. But we can agree to disagree. :smile:
  • WestEndFotoWestEndFoto Posts: 3,745Member

    Hopefully an AF fix can be done with software updates over time. Time for Nikon to copy Tesla on improving existing products with software updates. Not just fix bugs; actually improve the products and add new features like eye autofocus. Nikon software is already identifying the face why not add another step and identify the eye?

    This may not be as easy as it sounds. Three factors come into my mind that affect AF performance, and I am sure there are others. They are algorithms, processor speed and battery life.

    For example, an improvement in algorithms is likely pretty easy to do. Simply do more processing. But that might slow the AF to the point that it affects its performance negatively, neutralizing the gain, and using more battery power. Now Nikon could install a more powerful processor, but that might affect size, weight and battery life again.

    It is a tradeoff. My understanding is that Sony cameras can run quite hot, which may impact durability.

    And for 90% of the shooters on this forum, it is likely that the AF will not affect what they shoot or if it does, not in a materially bothersome way. For myself, I think that it would be a factor sometimes, but then I will use my D850. If I decide to spring for a Z7, or more likely a Z8, then it will be a walk around camera and I will use my D850 when I am serious about auto-focus performance. Or perhaps I can use the Z7/8 for portraiture so I can take advantage of the whole frame while auto-focussing.
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