NIKON...MIRROR LESS NOW WITH FIRMWARE UPDATE

Symphotic

I just pre-ordered the 14-30. My biggest problem with the Z7 is that I kept running into the wall at 24 mm on the 24-70 mm zoom. I am now completely convinced by the lighter weight and portability of the Z cameras, and the 14-24 with an FTZ adapter is not the way to go to get wide angle, as good as it is on the D850.

donaldejose

For those who want a larger (taller) Z body for pinky finger grip. This L bracket extends the grip length almost 3/4th of an inch and does not interfere with battery replacement.



















https://www.ebay.com/itm/SmallRig-L-Bracket-for-Nikon-Z6-and-Nikon-Z7-Camera-2258/264081775678?ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

donaldejose

Adding eye auto focus through a software update sounds great and hopefully Nikon will continue adding features through software updates when possible. Since eye auto focus is sensor based it should work well with the 50mm f1.2 out in 2020. Since the 58mm f0.95 Noct will be manual focus it won't work with eye focus and we will need to use focus peaking with that lens, it won't be quick but the 50mm f1.2 could be.

Searcy

donaldejose said:

For those who want a larger (taller) Z body for pinky finger grip. This L bracket extends the grip length almost 3/4th of an inch and does not interfere with battery replacement.

Thanks for posting that. I have big hands and I may need to look at that. It looks much better designed than the ones that are twice he price.

spraynpray

LOL! Get yourself a nice D850...

WestEndFoto

spraynpray said:

LOL! Get yourself a nice D850...

Yes......I will likely hold off on the Z until they offer something like a D850, unless I have money burning a hole in my pocket and need a toy...….

Pistnbroke

or a nice D850 with a grip......
yes west end I am holding off until I see great autofocus on the Z series

WestEndFoto

Pistnbroke said:

or a nice D850 with a grip......
yes west end I am holding off until I see great autofocus on the Z series

Yes, definitely like a D850 with a grip. My D850 without the grip just doesn't feel right. I never take it off.

I am actually not that concerned about auto-focus on mirrorless. I have 14 f-mount autofocus lenses and will buy DSLRs until Nikon no longer makes them. I will always have access to superior auto-focus if I need it.

The reason that I really want to buy a z-mount camera is for focus peaking with my 8 AIS and PC lenses and numerous pre-AIS lenses.

Searcy

spraynpray said:

LOL! Get yourself a nice D850...

I didn't have the $4000+ for the d850+ grip+extra battery+charger. Besides the 850 can't come close to competing with the Zs when it comes to video tracking which is something I'm needing more and more these days.

I do hope we get to see that Z battery grip soon. My hand would like a little more beef to be comfortable.

spraynpray

Searcy said:

spraynpray said:

LOL! Get yourself a nice D850...

I didn't have the $4000+ for the d850+ grip+extra battery+charger. Besides the 850 can't come close to competing with the Zs when it comes to video tracking which is something I'm needing more and more these days.

I do hope we get to see that Z battery grip soon. My hand would like a little more beef to be comfortable.

LOL! I get that. My post was facetious as Nikon have made the Z series to be as small as they can and you straight away try to make it DSLR size.

WestEndFoto

I want it to be DSLR sized to. I want the “D5” ergonomics that a D850 with a grip comes closest to achieving and I want all the performance that can be stuffed into that size. I may yet get the small form factor of a Z7, but it won’t be my serious camera except maybe with “scapes” to take advantage of the benefits of the wide angle Z lenses.

DenverShooter

spraynpray said:

LOL! Get yourself a nice D850...

What he said.

Denver Shooter

mhedges

The other day I went out shooting with a guy who had a D810. After using a Z6 I personally would not want to lug something that big and heavy around with me. Even though I have big hands.

WestEndFoto

mhedges said:

The other day I went out shooting with a guy who had a D810. After using a Z6 I personally would not want to lug something that big and heavy around with me. Even though I have big hands.

To each their own. I am quite happy that Nikon has found an excellent balance between performance and size with the Z6, Z7 and 1.8 lenses. I could see myself using a setup up like that on occasion. However, I think that now that Nikon has made that statement that was necessary from a market positioning perspective, I would like to see what they can do with the z mount if "size and weight be damned". The "Noct" is a good start.

I would also like to see how small they could make the z-mount. My wife's D5500 demonstrates to me that small was possible even on the f-mount. All this "size and weight" talk regarding the advantages and disadvantages of various mounts is for the most part marketing nonsense. I only say "most part" because I think it has some validity on the wide end (re: size of retrofocus wide lenses).


I wonder if I have predicted Nikon's marketing and product strategy? The only question is whether they will do a crop sensor on the Z-mount, or start a new mount, or find a way to offer inexpensive full frame cameras.

WestEndFoto

mhedges said:

The other day I went out shooting with a guy who had a D810. After using a Z6 I personally would not want to lug something that big and heavy around with me. Even though I have big hands.

Did the D810 have a grip on it Mhedges?

Searcy

I would not be surprised if Nikon puts out a "pro grade" Z mount mirrorless with a more traditional DSLR size and shape and button layout in the near future.

The small size of the Sony was one thing I didn't like about it at all. My decision to switch to mirrorless wasn't about size. It was about function. I shot over 1000 shots with the Z6 last night, my first real workout with it and I have to admit the small size did trip me up on occasion. That said.... it out shot my d7200 by miles and miles though I did have to change batteries at one point. Fortunately the batteries from my d7200 work in the Z6.

retread

After shooting with two cameras (D500 & C7200) with grips I do not want to go back to no grip. The camera size seems about right to me. My hands are a little on the small side for a man but not tiny. If they make it lighter that is fine, less weight to lug around.
If they make a crop sensor camera it should use the same Z mount. I shoot mostly with FF lenses as part of my hoped move to full frame.
At this point I think my next camera will be a D8?? with a grip.

Capt_Spaulding

@Searcy I'm curious what you mean by your Z6 outshooting the D7200. What dimensions of performance are you considering? In what ways did the 6 outperform the 7200. I'm very unlikely to change in the near or even medium term, just wondering.

WestEndFoto

Nikon has indicated that the "S-line" is a professional grade - similar to Nikon's Gold Ring lenses for the f-mount. I was mildly surprised that their 1.8 lenses are in this category, but in retrospect, I think it is smart. I think that in the f-mount, Nikon's options were limited in a way that this new strategy will prevent.

They have also indicated that they will have a line of less expensive "enthusiast" lenses. They have done this before with their "Series E" lenses, many of which I have and don't include on any lists when people ask what I have.

I can imagine Nikon launching a modern "Series E" line on the Z mount and the "Series E" cameras will be a crop sensor. The lenses, however, will be full frame. If you want wide on a crop sensor, I image that there will be a roughly 10mm full frame lens for that market. I also might imagine that this modern "Series E" might have something like 1.4 and 2.0 lenses.

I think that this will be a prudent strategy for Nikon as it will supply the enthusiast market with the lower price point where the volume is, but there will also be a clear upgrade path without the "break" in the DX to FX upgrade path. The "break" is the obsolescence of DX lenses if a user upgraded to FX - essentially the user was abandoning an old system for an almost entirely new system. If Nikon decided on this strategy and executes on it, the upgrade path from a crop sensor camera to a full frame sensor camera will be easy, as the user's lenses will work just like before, except even better. I believe that DX and FX where always awkward in this respect.


Bye the way, regarding my "Death of F-Mount DX Challenge", if Nikon stops offering DX on the F-Mount but replaces it with a crop sensor on the Z-Mount, DX is still dead. My prediction that F-Mount DX will die still stands, despite what Nikon may do in the future with crop sensor cameras and lenses.

Searcy

Capt_Spaulding said:

@Searcy I'm curious what you mean by your Z6 outshooting the D7200. What dimensions of performance are you considering? In what ways did the 6 outperform the 7200. I'm very unlikely to change in the near or even medium term, just wondering.

The ISO range is much more usable on the Z6 than the d7200. Navigating menus while working an event is much simpler. The tilting touch screen means I can told the camera over my head and grab a shot over the crowd. The video on the Z6 is actually something usable. I hooked up my SB700 last night and tried the TTL for some shots. It was totally which I never found to be the case with the d7200. It's focus is just as fast. The EVF helps keep track of ever changing light as something like a rock and roll show like I was shooting last night.

The only trouble I had was how it felt to my right hand. The ISO button isn't where I would have put it.I may reassign that the the F1 button later but that's not an easy button to reach either.

mhedges

WestEndFoto said:

mhedges said:

The other day I went out shooting with a guy who had a D810. After using a Z6 I personally would not want to lug something that big and heavy around with me. Even though I have big hands.

Did the D810 have a grip on it Mhedges?

No it didn’t. And to be fair I didn’t really use it.

Searcy said:

Capt_Spaulding said:

@Searcy I'm curious what you mean by your Z6 outshooting the D7200. What dimensions of performance are you considering? In what ways did the 6 outperform the 7200. I'm very unlikely to change in the near or even medium term, just wondering.

The ISO range is much more usable on the Z6 than the d7200. Navigating menus while working an event is much simpler. The tilting touch screen means I can told the camera over my head and grab a shot over the crowd. The video on the Z6 is actually something usable. I hooked up my SB700 last night and tried the TTL for some shots. It was totally which I never found to be the case with the d7200. It's focus is just as fast. The EVF helps keep track of ever changing light as something like a rock and roll show like I was shooting last night.

The only trouble I had was how it felt to my right hand. The ISO button isn't where I would have put it.I may reassign that the the F1 button later but that's not an easy button to reach either.

Yep all this. And even comparing base ISO performance to me Z6 image quality is noticeably better than D7200 in pretty much all aspects. Also IBIS stabilizing all your lenses is really great.

As far as button layout - I don’t use the ISO button much (pretty much auto ISO everything). For me F1 is fine. My ring finger lines up with it well. I do have a lot of trouble finding the exposure compensation button. It’s just a little too far over and a little too sideways.

Capt_Spaulding

@Searcy

Many thanks

PB_PM

mhedges said:

Searcy said:

Capt_Spaulding said:

@Searcy I'm curious what you mean by your Z6 outshooting the D7200. What dimensions of performance are you considering? In what ways did the 6 outperform the 7200. I'm very unlikely to change in the near or even medium term, just wondering.

The ISO range is much more usable on the Z6 than the d7200. Navigating menus while working an event is much simpler. The tilting touch screen means I can told the camera over my head and grab a shot over the crowd. The video on the Z6 is actually something usable. I hooked up my SB700 last night and tried the TTL for some shots. It was totally which I never found to be the case with the d7200. It's focus is just as fast. The EVF helps keep track of ever changing light as something like a rock and roll show like I was shooting last night.

The only trouble I had was how it felt to my right hand. The ISO button isn't where I would have put it.I may reassign that the the F1 button later but that's not an easy button to reach either.

Yep all this. And even comparing base ISO performance to me Z6 image quality is noticeably better than D7200 in pretty much all aspects. Also IBIS stabilizing all your lenses is really great.

As far as button layout - I don’t use the ISO button much (pretty much auto ISO everything). For me F1 is fine. My ring finger lines up with it well. I do have a lot of trouble finding the exposure compensation button. It’s just a little too far over and a little too sideways.

No surprise there, the D750, which shares the same sensor as the Z6 also is much better at high ISO than the D7200.

As for comfort vs big bodies, I love the large gripped bodies personally. I keep the grip on my D810 all the time. I don’t have one on my D750, since the point of it is have a smaller camera, but the ergonomics without the grip are inferior, unless you only shoot horizontally. People who have never shot with a grip have no idea how freeing it is for vertical shooting and overall comfort. The only downside is that the D810 with grip is bigger and heavier than a D4/D5.

Searcy

PB_PM said:

As for comfort vs big bodies, I love the large gripped bodies personally. I keep the grip on my D810 all the time.

I have to agree. Adding the grip to my 7200 was a real improvement in feel and battery life. Having two batteries in the d7200 spoiled me. I got used to going a month without charging a battery.

Searcy

"As far as button layout - I don’t use the ISO button much (pretty much auto ISO everything). For me F1 is fine. My ring finger lines up with it well. I do have a lot of trouble finding the exposure compensation button. It’s just a little too far over and a little too sideways."

Years ago when I bought my d7200 I was excited because it had Auto ISO. On my first trip out with it I shot an event where I was also acting as a front of house manager. To say I was very distracted in dealing with all the drama dealing with vendors and models and all would be an understatement. Knowing this I set the auto ISO, opting to let the camera do the thinking for me. Long story short... my results were so noisy that I found them unusable. Every since then I have been a little timid about setting my ISO to auto.

As for image quality, YES! The shots out of my z6 looked a lot like the shots out of my friends d750 that I have been envying all year. I think that is largly a result of FX vs DX sensor performance.

All in all the d7200 has served me well. It was the $1000 camera I needed at that point in my photography and I'm not about to give it up just yet.

I feel equally good about buying the $2000 z6. I hope it lasts me as long as the d7200 has. I look forward to the z6 battery grip.