Nikon D610 discussion

heartyfisher

Well, cleaning oil off the sensor every week or so may push some to upgrade. ;-)

PS: Heard good things about the HTC One's camera.. any thing you can say about it? I must admit I don't know much about it.

Golf007sd

I....run the HTC ONE Users Group...at Flickr....some of the images I see there would put many Nikon owners to shame, in terms of composition and pushing the limitations of a smart phone.....photography very rarely comes down to what piece of technology your holding and only for the very few will it make them better photographers...

Your remark lack substance. A D-SLR serve a specific function, much like a cell phone does. Just because a cell phone has a lens on it, does not mean it will put anything to shame. In fact, you last comment completely makes your first comment mute.

Photobug

Golf007sd.... LOL

Ade

Hmm, well I'm a gear-head, love the specs, and am very technical in nature -- but to a great extent I agree @symbolizm

spraynpray

It amazes me how new technology captures the minds and imaginations of potential camera buyers in such a powerful way. What ever the specifications of the d610 will be, it's hardly going to set the World on fire and will certainly not change the way you take photos or change the image quality in an Earth shattering way.

I am fortunate enough to run the HTC ONE Users Group here at Flickr www.flickr.com/groups/htc-one and some of the images I see there would put many Nikon owners to shame, in terms of composition and pushing the limitations of a smart phone to get amazing results. So to conclude photography very rarely comes down to what piece of technology your holding and only for the very few will it make them better photographers, so if you have a d600 what's the point in so called upgrading?

@symbolizm: I wonder if you read anything on this forum before posting or know anything of the D600 and its history? If you did, you would know that the excitement about the D610 is that is is likely to be what the unfortunately flawed D600 should have been which is an entry level full-frame body - that is the 'excitment'. Your comments about the cellphone camera lack credibility because its usage is so limited by its optics and sensor size which mean it could never come close to any DSLR for having the flexibility to be used across the same spectrum of genres as a DSLR.

Perhaps you would like to post some 1:1 macro, astro photography. differential focus, BIF or high-speed motorsport shots taken with your cellphone? If they are that good, I may just upgrade my kit to an HTC cellphone :P

kenadams

However, the regular D7000 kit will give you a 1:1 macro?? What about a Leica for BIF and high speed motorsports??

Don't know what the fuss is, I think we've all agreed at one point or another that the main part in all this is the photographer, not the camera, and that I think is the point he's making.

You don't need a D4 to take a decent picture, neither does owning one guarantee you'll ever get there. Go check out the Instagram feeds of some of the more renowned photographers, and you'll see that gear snobbiness is for amateurs.

spraynpray

"You don't need a D4 to take a decent picture, neither does owning one guarantee you'll ever get there. Go check out the Instagram feeds of some of the more renowned photographers, and you'll see that gear snobbiness is for amateurs."

Agreed @kenadams - as is the inverted snobbiness about cell phones being all you need. I 'only' have a D7000 (not a D800 or D4), it is the lenses that count, as you know.

I don't get your point about a Leica for BIF.

BTW - What D7000 kit gives 1:1 macro?

kenadams

That's my point exactly, it doesn't. You need very specific gear for that (doesn't necessarily equal expensive). A 6000€ Leica with a 3000€ lens won't give you the best options for birds in flight photography. Specific gear again. More expensive cameras may give you more options, though, however, it's what you make of them that makes the photo. And *that* in turn is the same for a cell phone camera. Can't do it all, but can do some things just fine. Btw, I don't think he said cell phones are all you need. Just that you don't always need the latest and greatest.

You may invest a thousand bucks in camera gear and still not have what you really need. Or you may cut down on the tech, get yourself back to basically the options you had a century ago (or the digital equivalent), when people put out amazing stuff without lens bags the size of a shipping container, and concentrate on what you can do with that. And I think everyone's photography will profit a good deal from that.

Golf007sd

@kenadams: We all know very well the underlying process of capturing an image and the gear needed in obtaining it...correctly. Hence, you need the right gear for BIF and if that is not fully understood by an individual then he or she needs to some more research.

I would like to see symbolizm try to freeze a humming bird wings with a cell phone...composition be damed. Your reference to Leica for BIF illustrates how silly/foolish would be to do so. Hell why not push it ever future and use it for underwater photography.

Their is a fine line in making a point without sounding like a "wise guy" ...for lack of a better word. Hence, symbolism comment: "would put many Nikon owners to shame."

Now...lets us all get back to the topic at hand: D610...thank you.

Ade

Beautiful iPhone pic of a hummingbird in flight, w/ Instagram and a digiscope:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/langooney/7253755688/

PB_PM

Beautiful iPhone pic of a hummingbird in flight, w/ Instagram and a digiscope:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/langooney/7253755688/

Other than the fact that it is out of focus, sure great.

warprints

Other than the fact that it is out of focus, sure great.

LOL - But it's an ARTISTIC shot --- not supposed to be in focus. LMAO. )

kenadams

Must be a forgery. It has just been decided that a cell phone can't do that, see the above posts. No cell phone has ever taken a picture of any sort of worth. Only DSLRs can deliver that.

MikeGunter

Hi all,

Cell phone technology is great.

And for those folks who are in the plain vanilla business of photography - weddings and the like - they ought to consider them a great worry. The better the technology becomes, the less concerned that segment of the photo-marketplace will care about buying photography.

Its already happening. Even what's her name at Flickr said there's no such thing as professional photography anymore, even though she back peddled her comments.

That's a huge paradigm shift, and photographers in that space need to figure out what they do to make a living.

Poking fun at images from cell phones or point and shoots can be good sport, but it's likely bad form.

Understanding what satisfies as art and producing it every day should be on the plate of every shooter.

My best as always,

Mike

spraynpray

Art Mike? Don't get me started on 'Art'! My Nephew took a picture of his mate puking during a heavy night out and it got very highly acclaimed by London 'Art cogniscente'! That is what cell phone snaps do quite well.

Ade

Eight years ago, Robert Clark, the veteran photographer who shot the first ever National Geographic cover using a digital camera, went on assignment touring the US in 50 days using only the 1.3mp Sony Ericsson S710a cell phone camera. He did some really beautiful work, much of it later published in the book Image America (you can see some of the pictures from Google image search).

This past summer, Stephen Alvarez, another National Geographic veteran, went on a similar assignment using a Nokia Lumia 1020.

Very few of us here can claim to be better photographers than Mr. Clark or Mr. Alvarez. Sure, there are types of assignments best captured using a D4 (or a D610). But I still agree that in general, "photography very rarely comes down to what piece of technology your holding and only for the very few will it make them better photographers" (to quote symbolizm).

Golf007sd

@Ade: A professional photographer understand the limitation of what a photographic device can do and cannot do. Clark and Alvarez are far...far from the average joe with a device in their hand. They fully understand the usage of light and how to best let if work for them in taking a shot. Hence for them, their limitation is the gear itself.

As for your humming bird image...it is triable representation of such a great bird...IMHO. Here is some that put that image "to shame."

MikeGunter

Art Mike? Don't get me started on 'Art'! My Nephew took a picture of his mate puking during a heavy night out and it got very highly acclaimed by London 'Art cogniscente'! That is what cell phone snaps do quite well.

Hi all,

@ spraynpray I neither tried to define nor elucidate the term. I don't think I can.

But if I were in the business of making pictures for a living, I'd do my best to make pictures that sold well, and that in itself would be an art.

My point is that the 'landscape' of photography is changing. I didn't imagine myself being able to take a picture with a Princess phone in 1965.

My best,

Mike

Ade

As for your humming bird image...it is triable representation of such a great bird...IMHO. Here is some that put that image "to shame."

Will all respect to coastalconn, but I actually rather enjoy viewing the iPhone version above. It is a beautiful capture, and if you can't see that, then I guess we just have to disagree.

tc88

Beautiful iPhone pic of a hummingbird in flight, w/ Instagram and a digiscope:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/langooney/7253755688/

That picture may be nice in the film age, but it's not much in today's standard. Basically there are many more better pictures of similar captures that the one you quoted does not stand out. No I don't care about that Instagram effect. If you start with a good picture, you can always add that.

Here is a picture another fellow memeber just posted a few days ago here which I consider to have much better quality than the iphone version.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/36823011@N05/4737851179

Here is a test for some people here. Take your favorite scenes and take pictures with both cell phone and DSLR. Go home and grade and compare those. Tell me whether the DSLR makes better pictures and thus makes you a better photographer? If so, are you one of those few select photographers?

It's somewhat a misnomer to say "it's the photographer, not the equipment". A lot of times they are laughing at people who don't even care about PSAM. For serious photographers who do honest self assessments, and know why and what to upgrade in their equipment, most likely the better equipment will elevate their photos and make them better photographers. Of course, the standard will also become higher when better technology becomes widerly available.

Golf007sd

@Ade..let me put it this way: their have been some fantastic images taken on a variety of modern devices. I would hope that the upcoming D610 would continue that tradition.

Ade

For serious photographers who do honest self assessments, and know why and what to upgrade in their equipment, most likely the better equipment will elevate their photos and make them better photographers.

I can honestly say that NO photography equipment I've EVER purchased has made me a better photographer.

And sadly, no golf equipment I've ever purchased has made me a better golfer, either.

Golf007sd

Golf, much like photography and the gear that goes with both, alway have a way of humbling the end user. The more you perfect your skills, in each, will...over time make you a better user. That said, you will never master the light and you will never master the course or the game of golf. Yet the reward of pushing the shutter button can be as rewarding and hit that great shot as it makes it way to the green and closer to the hole.

Drive on and press the button...

spraynpray

To further that analogy, an average beginner golfer will not appreciate - or extract the best from - the best gear which is the same as a beginner at photography. A much better photographer or golfer will see an improvement in performance as he/she is able to extract more performance from the gear. I have seen it over the years with some NR members work.

Of course there are those who belie this analogy, but as a general observation, it works.

Ade

So many golfers believe they will be a great golfer by buying an expensive driver, or that they can rule to greens by buying that magic putter.

Apparently many photographers feel the same way. Sorry, buying a D610 will not make you a better photographer.