Nikon Retro F-Mount Camera (FM2 Style)

Msmoto

I suppose my question is what this retro body will do that cannot be accomplished by the current lineup....

adamz

@msmoto - look and feel

shawnino

Well @msmoto, I'm not buying a body but if I was, near $2K, this would likely be the one. I'd love the D4 sensor but I don't need the build or the fps that takes the D4 to $6,000. Lots of people do, but I don't. I love my D800E, but if the sensor in DF was D4, I'd take that sensor over the 36MP. The final 1% (the cherry on top) would be using my uncle's old glass. I guess I could get it AI-converted but I don't know anybody in Canada who does that and can just hear my family screaming if "family heirlooms got lost in the mail".

The ad campaign does nothing for me. I couldn't care less what the camera looks like. (When I go to Moscow, I use tape to make my gear look as crummy as possible.) Of course, ergonomics/ease-of-use has to be passable.

Where I'm probably getting tricked/deceived is my illusion that I'm somehow saving a little money because there's no video option. I don't use video.

Elvishefer

I suppose my question is what this retro body will do that cannot be accomplished by the current lineup....

It's all about the D4 sensor in a cheaper package for me. I don't need the FPS either (but I do like the D4 body style), and I can't justify the $6k for ergonomics/ease of use. I'm not a working pro.

But I could sell off some gear for under $2k and get one of these cameras without pause.

framer

I going to guess because it has the 610 innards that the sensor is 24MP. This would also keep the price down.

framer

donaldejose

Framer: I too think there is a very strong chance the sensor is the same as in the D600/D610 rather than the one in the D4.

Elvishefer

I think you're both thinking imPUREly.

I hope you're wrong but that could be the Nikon brain fart I've been waiting for...

Symphotic

610 innards in a high quality body? Would that need to be priced $500 or JYE50,000 lower than the D800? Unless there is something else we need to know, I'm having trouble figuring out where this will fit in the product line.
I almost expect it to be MORE expensive than a D800 now and targeted to the boutique camera buyers, sort of like the F3/T of the past. A great camera, indeed, but no real advantage over the F3. I'm really confused now.

framer

I don't think it needs to fit in anywhere. It will stand on it own for those that want the look. feel and experience that it will bring. Personally I feel it a lot of hype but a limited market. It's the thing that you may find cool but do you really need it for your style photography.

framer

tman

The camera appeals very strongly to me; An amateurs who find that EVERY camera from D7000 upwards has 90% more content than I will ever use and enough FX lenses from the film era that the move to FX is compelling if the price is low and value is high. The shape of the camera seems to be a statement of what it is trying to be. If it delivers on the promise for <$2000 I HAVE to buy it and I know 3 other guys who will -- one of whom will sell his D600 at a loss to get it since he finds the ergonomics of D600 more challenging.

tman

And saying it's a 16MP sensor, doesn't mean it's D4, does it? THere are rumors from last year that Aptina was making FX sensors for Nikon; Similar to the way Aptina 16MP sensors replaced Sony in some newer Nikon DX model.

PB_PM

The sensor in the D4 is not made by Sony, so that's a non issue.

Ade

@tman The original rumor had it as a D4 sensor, so not just 16MP but having high-ISO capabilities as well. I guess the type of sensor will largely determine whether this will be a ~ $2000 camera or a $3000 one. Hopefully we will see more juicy leaks this weekend ahead of the official announcement.

TaoTeJared

I suppose my question is what this retro body will do that cannot be accomplished by the current lineup....

If it has the high ISO capabilities of the D4 then I see it as a much needed/desired body. (If rumored specs true) 5.5fps, 16mp High iso, FX and not $6000. For me, I just can't justify $6000 for a D4 body that I would only use it's added abilities over my D800 occasionally. Other than just the affinity towards the retro designs, the extreme premium for that high ISO sensor just doesn't make much since.

Really, If you get over the "retro" and called that camera the D710 the whole internet would be bursting with the word "FINALLY!"

PB_PM

^ Right on the money.

WestEndBoy

TaoTejared said:
If it has the high ISO capabilities of the D4 then I see it as a much needed/desired body.

You might be careful about reading too much into the high ISO capabilities. Just because a camera can shoot at 20,000 doesn't mean that you would want to.

The DXo tests suggest that all Nikon FX cameras reach unacceptable noise around the 3,000 ish ISO level (I admit that the "unacceptable level" is quite arbitrary. In fact, the Nikons are better than the Canons in this regard even though the Canons CAN shoot at higher ISO.

So much for manufacturer specs................

Golf007sd

@jshickele: Please note the word if in TTJ comment. Hence, he is taking cautious step.

As an owner of a D4 that knows full well how it handles high ISO, I welcome Nikon decision in incorporating this sensor in this new body, thus allowing those that seek such a DSLR form factor to have one.

As for DXOmark, I could care less what they have to say about me or anyone else usage of what ISO is best. Let the photographer be the judge on that. Moreover, an image taken where a high level of ISO was needed maybe perfectly usable given the intended usage...such as web posting or small size print where the noise level is actable to the photograph and those it is sharing it with.

TaoTeJared

Yes the IF...

In the back of my pragmatic mind, and seeing how many bought D700s instead of D3 bodies because they were the same sensor, I have a feeling this 16mp sensor will not match the D4 completely. Then again, the Olympics are around the corner and maybe a new 16, 18, 20mp D4s that will smoke it, is on it's way.

You might be careful about reading too much into the high ISO capabilities. Just because a camera can shoot at 20,000 doesn't mean that you would want to.

I'm well aware of ISOs and their limitations. Supposedly my D800 is good to 2800 but I rarely go above 640 for work or 800. If I'm always sitting at the level, I'm looking to add lighting to get it back down to the 400 range. And I'm not interested in shooting anything above 6400 or even 3200. I'm more interested in the dynamic range at higher ISOs that the D4 has than any upper limit or noise. Most of my images above 1600 I turn to B&W and adding more color creates richer tones and a deeper files to work with. Even adding just one stop really does make a difference.

Msmoto

Here is the D4 at 10,000 ISO....and this has been viewed over 4,000 times on Flickr:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/fantinesfotos/7091167431/sizes/o/

shawnino

...and that's why I'd be interested, @msmoto. I doubt I'll ever need ISO 10,000 much, but holy crap. If I did, and that's what the gear does in your hands, well, if my shot was 50% as good, I'd be over the moon. Period.

PB_PM

@Msmoto is that right out of camera or have you used some high quality noise reduction software on the shot?

moreorless

Tao, I'd hope that this camera is already different enough from the D4 that just chopping off the extreme ISO settings would be enough rather than handicapping the sensor as a whole. I'm guessing such high ISO's are really only important to a small number of specialist pro's anyway.

Looking at the latest video's the camera itself looks like a "hybrid" keeping a good deal of the current DSLR setup but adding in multiple(looks it it could have 4) top plate dials. A weakness of a lot of recent retro digital camera's is IMHO a lack of an ISO dial on the top plate since this is now a much more fluid setting that the film era.

Gareth

It looks like if I want the d710 aka Df i need to sacrifice partial stops. Not sure if I want to.

Msmoto

@PB_PM

I do not use any noise reduction. There is some tonal manipulation in LR. Of interest is the lens...maybe 15 years old or more. 28.0-85.0 mm f/3.5-4.5. The Exif data is here:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/fantinesfotos/7091167431/meta/

donaldejose

I don't think you will have to sacrifice partial stops any more than you did with the FE2. Sure you can set an exact shutter speed but there will also be a mode dial you can set on S priority and the body will use matrix metering to select the stepless f-stop. Or you can set to Auto ISO of 100 to 200 (one stop) and then set both the shutter and aperture to exact settings and the matrix metering will give you a perfect exposure using a "stepless" ISO. There also may be half stop clicks on the aperture ring. Nikon won't cripple the camera by allowing only exact shutter speed, exact f-stop and exact ISO. That only worked back in the film days when the printer could adjust a few stops.

The more I see of this camera the more I would like to have one just for the sake of working with the old analogue world user interface once again some of the time.