NIKON...MIRROR LESS NOW WITH FIRMWARE UPDATE

mhedges

spraynpray said:

When using my cameras, after turning it on I usually touch the shutter button to get the focus close before composing. When shooting sports or macro with AF-C, I track the subject with the first pressure taken up. I see no issues with turning the camera on. As for what happens when it times out, that is up to the designers. It needs to be fully off so lenses and batteries can be changed.

Well I'll certainly admit to having forgotten to turn mine off before changing lenses more than once, and so far I haven't had any problems. Is it really a risk?

snakebunk

Like HankB I think the devil is in the details, and maybe there is some genius way to construct a camera without an on/off-switch.

But, I really don't want to have to push/touch the shutter to start the camera. I don't use the shutter button for af and it would be very anoying to have to keep touching it all the time.

Also I think the stand by mode works great and consumes very little energy, and I think it could be more expensive to keep restarting the camera.

spraynpray

May improve battery life...

snakebunk

I looked at the video again and I think there is an on/off-switch. Lets see.

Searcy

I've left my d7200 on for days at a time. It's so good on batteries I don't notice a down side.

BVS

If it doesn't have an on/off switch I expect Nikon support will be getting a lot of calls from confused people unsure how to turn the camera on or off.

Also, what happens if the shutter release and some other buttons gets bumped during transport? It'd suck to get to your shooting location and discover an empty battery and an extra long 4K video of the inside the of lens cap.

Surely they can do both a switch and a timeout/standby like the current DSLRs, no?

BVS

Hiker said:

Soooooo....that's it? A carrot dangled in front of us for months and to have Nikon release just THAT? I can put on Star Wars and Star Trek movies and get those special effects. Now we (might) have to wait until Wednesday for an official announcement because that's their anniversary? Good god...

Even July 25th announcement has only ever been a rumor, and Admin Peter has said multiple times that he had doubts about the date.

This 'release' seems to be following a similar pattern to the D850 from last year - start with a teaser video that tells us next to nothing but starts getting excitement up, then some darkened leaked pics that we study in excruciating detail for weeks causing wild speculation and discussion, and then the real announcement in August/September and a happy conclusion.

retread

I am happy with the arrangement of the buttons on my D500 an hope they don't very much from that.

BabaGanoush

I'm hoping the availability of Nikon's mirrorless offerings doesn't follow the pattern of the persistent "Out of Stock" pattern of the D850 in the US, a year after the original announcement of the camera. Peter was ranting about that today. Maybe some knowledgeable people here can enlighten him on why that is.

sport

It comes down to two things, sales forecasting and manufacturing capacity. Nikon seems to like having their hot cameras listed as out of stock in the US and available everywhere else. If this is some marketing strategy for the US then good luck. As far as manufacturing capacity goes, it's a double edged sword. Nikon is balancing enough capacity to keep up with demand vs keeping costs in check.

BabaGanoush

sport said:

It comes down to two things, sales forecasting and manufacturing capacity. Nikon seems to like having their hot cameras listed as out of stock in the US and available everywhere else. If this is some marketing strategy for the US then good luck. As far as manufacturing capacity goes, it's a double edged sword. Nikon is balancing enough capacity to keep up with demand vs keeping costs in check.

The cynical view is that Nikon expected from the start its DSLR owners would never jump ship once the D850 was announced, even if it got long delayed. Where would we go? To Canon? Nonsense. However, when it comes to mirrorless, their marketing approach or strategy has to be different because it's a completely new mount and a possibly different customer base. Sony is already in that market segment with strong offerings, while Canon will be announcing their mirrorless FF camera in early September just as Nikon announces theirs. First impressions will matter, not just for Nikon's current fiscal year, but perhaps even long term. If Nikon indicates its mirrorless camera will not be in stock until 2019, I will pick up a Sony A7 III in the next month or two and then take my time to see how the Nikon FF camera is received. Eventually I expect to have both, but time will tell.

NSXTypeR

spraynpray said:

I don't get why we even need an on/off switch. Just auto-on when we touch the shutter button and auto off after 10 secs inactivity.

What you're basically suggesting is equivalent to a gun without a safety (to be fair I don't own a gun and don't shoot one but have shot air rifles/BBs). If you own a gun you're going to fire it anyway, why bother with a safety?

I can see lots of problems with your solution. The biggest problem is that in transport you may find your camera body dead with 600 photos of a black lens cap because it was bouncing around in your bag and it found itself upside down, resting on the shutter button. Like others have said, it causes confusion, so I don't think that's good ergonomics/camera design.

sport

BabaGanoush said:

The cynical view is that Nikon expected from the start its DSLR owners would never jump ship once the D850 was announced, even if it got long delayed. Where would we go? To Canon? Nonsense. However, when it comes to mirrorless, their marketing approach or strategy has to be different because it's a completely new mount and a possibly different customer base. Sony is already in that market segment with strong offerings, while Canon will be announcing their mirrorless FF camera in early September just as Nikon announces theirs. First impressions will matter, not just for Nikon's current fiscal year, but perhaps even long term. If Nikon indicates its mirrorless camera will not be in stock until 2019, I will pick up a Sony A7 III in the next month or two and then take my time to see how the Nikon FF camera is received. Eventually I expect to have both, but time will tell.

I understand what your saying. This is a big transition for Nikon and they can't really afford to make the same mistakes from the past. I feel that Canon is the biggest hurdle for Nikon. Canon also has to keep moving towards mirrorless and their user base seems to like what they have done so far.

spraynpray

NSXTypeR said:

spraynpray said:

I don't get why we even need an on/off switch. Just auto-on when we touch the shutter button and auto off after 10 secs inactivity.

What you're basically suggesting is equivalent to a gun without a safety (to be fair I don't own a gun and don't shoot one but have shot air rifles/BBs). If you own a gun you're going to fire it anyway, why bother with a safety?

I can see lots of problems with your solution. The biggest problem is that in transport you may find your camera body dead with 600 photos of a black lens cap because it was bouncing around in your bag and it found itself upside down, resting on the shutter button. Like others have said, it causes confusion, so I don't think that's good ergonomics/camera design.

Not a great analogy, more like the evolution of the Glock type weapons with a safety on the trigger. Unless you are inept and stupid, you don't touch the trigger of a gun until it is pointing pretty much in the direction of the target so why give yourself another unnecessary time-consuming action like contorting for a through bar safety or changing your grip for a thumb safety?

As for the transportation thing where you may accidentally repeatedly 'bump' your shutter button, you mean to tell me that your protection for your camera is so poor that you allow it to 'bump' against other things? Ay-Caramba. Still, to go back to the gun analogy, you do read about people with similar problems exterminating themselves so it is only a matter of time until no off switch works - it's Darwinian. LOL!

To be clear, I am not saying the new camera doesn't have or need an off switch, just allowing my mind to wander around whether we actually need one at all.

Searcy

NSXTypeR said:

spraynpray said:

I don't get why we even need an on/off switch. Just auto-on when we touch the shutter button and auto off after 10 secs inactivity.

What you're basically suggesting is equivalent to a gun without a safety (to be fair I don't own a gun and don't shoot one but have shot air rifles/BBs). If you own a gun you're going to fire it anyway, why bother with a safety?

I can see lots of problems with your solution. The biggest problem is that in transport you may find your camera body dead with 600 photos of a black lens cap because it was bouncing around in your bag and it found itself upside down, resting on the shutter button. Like others have said, it causes confusion, so I don't think that's good ergonomics/camera design.

My .40cal Beretta 9000S (double action only) doesn't have a safety and I don't think I would be interested in a hand gun that had one. It's just one more thing to fumble with.

Getting rid of an on/off switch (or leaving it right where it was) is not a game changer for me.

Searcy

"Additionally, a new mount adapter is being developed for the new mirrorless camera. This will work with the NIKKOR F mount lenses that are part of the Nikon digital SLR system, adding to the variety of choices for photographers."

Interesting.

spraynpray

Earlier on in the rumours, Nikon said one body would have a new 24-70 lens, the other was left TBA. I postulated that the other body may be a DX because if they had given the focal length out it would have given the game away that is was DX. OK, the DX guess wasn't right, but what about the second body being F-mount compatible without an adaptor?

Hmmm.

Ton14

@Searcy That's the most important thing for me.

dougjgreen

So it looks like for at least the remainder of 2018, my discontinued J5 is going to be the best Nikon Mirrorless camera that anyone can actually shoot with.

donaldejose

I suggest we will see two bodies with different sensors and different controls: one 24mp sensor with an "amature" control layout and one 45mp sensor with the "pro" control layout. Of course, since the whole mirrorless body will be different than a DLSR body with different control layouts I do not mean one of the new bodies will be exactly like a D750 control layout and one exactly like a D850 control layout. I just mean Nikon will continue to use two different "amature" and "pro" control layouts in their new mirrorless bodies. Also, the "pro" control layout body will have a greater degree of weatherproofing and an overall more robust build. Think of one body as a mirrorless replacement for the D750 and the other as a mirrorless replacement for the D850. DX at the D7500 and D500 build level may be abandoned in the new mirrorless lineup with the only DX senor mirrorless being at the D3400 and D5600 level. We will see if this is correct or not.

I have a question: Why does the eyepiece protrude so far to the rear in the new mirrorless body? It seems to protrude more than that of the Sony A7 III? is it to provide a greater magnification ratio for the EVF? Sony A7 III is 0.78x magnification; D850 is 0.75x, D500 is 0.70x. Greater magnification might be nice. How about a 1x EVF with no noticeable time delay so you can shoot with both eyes open? Wouldn't that be a good idea?

mhedges

As a person with a fairly large nose I like how the eyepiece protrudes.

Capt_Spaulding

@Searcy I'm not sure the DAO Beretta is all that good an analogy. Double action is in a sense a safety, much like the requirement that one manually cock a single action revolver. With the hammer down, a long, (somewhat) stiff double action pull makes an unintentional discharge much less likely. Unless the shutter release (and most to all) the other electronic controls cannot be actuated unintentionally IMHO cameras (and all of my guns) will probably have some sort of safety.

spraynpray

People will always find a way to a/d guns and cameras!

HankB

“…F-mount compatible without an adaptor” —
The only practical way to do this would be to produce a totally F mount mirrorless body. Would this be much different from a new mount body with the adapter epoxied on?


"I just mean Nikon will continue to use two different "amature" and "pro" control layouts in their new mirrorless bodies." —
Maybe the smart way to go would be to combine the best of both systems into a well thought out new system. Consider that just being mirrorless will require at minimum, some modification to the menus anyway.

tc88

They can fuse the adapter with the camera and sell it to die hard F-mount fans as an F-mount mirrorless. But I would rather have it separately.

I was hoping that the adapter will come bundled with the camera initially to speed the adoption. But the phrase "being developed" could mean it may not even be available at the initial release since it can take a while for it to go from development to production to sale. That could mean it will likely be sold separately and can be expensive with the way Nikon typically prices these things.